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Quad Roller Skating Forum Discussions about quad roller skates and any other quad skating discussions that do not seem appropriate for one of our other forums.

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Old January 18th, 2017, 12:39 AM   #1
fierocious1
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Default Feet and offset

Something new skaters may not see at first but it just might help you or prevent you from getting sore feet.

Offset of the plates from side to side. Several years ago I was pushing speed very hard during lax sessions. After getting out of there to go home my right foot would hurt on the outside and across the top on the right side. It was getting worse and worse each time I went skating. Finally I stopped and took a more serious look at my mounting. I was offset a little to the outside, boots out, more wheel showing on the inside. I had been skating this way for some time, year and a half or so. Took the plates off and shifted the alignment. Started skating again the next weekend, no sore feet.
Move ahead several years. Adapted some inline boots to my White Magnums. The boots did not have a slotted mounting in the bottom. So side to side adjustments were not possible, there were several threaded holes in different positions so I used them an mounted the boots with as little offset as I could manage. At this time I came back from inline skating to strictly quads again. It did not take long, 8 or 9 months to get my coordination back up to par and speed was coming along again too. Then what I forgot got me really good, boot offset. I was coming out of a turn easing up after running down a couple of inliners.....something felt odd, so I pulled up and off the floor for a minute. My foot hurt a little, no problem, I'll go back to the floor and work it out. NOPE, as soon as I hit the floor the pain went up and got worse, I did not finish the lap and limped back in. No more skating tonight. Wife and I went to eat and I could barely walk from the car to the restaurant. Then barely walk for the next week at work. You will either break the lateral bone or tear the ligaments off the bone. Very painful. My foot crunched as I walked.
Offset is very important. My cause was a lateral overload in my right foot. Too much offset of the boot to the outside can cause too much stress on your feet. You will be fighting against your own forces to make the boot lean in, but your weight and the position of the boot on the plate want your foot to turn out instead. These forces at odds work your feet harder than they have to be worked.
I was off skating for 12 weeks.
Came back only after all the pain was gone. Not regretting taking the time off because I'm not fighting pain now.
If you have more wheel showing on the inside than on the outside of you soles, you are hurting your feet. My boots/plates are centered now and there are no issues. I should have not taken the chance when I put the skates together but you know, "awww it will be OK, I'll get away with it".
So please check your offset, it is very important for your feet.
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Old January 18th, 2017, 01:12 AM   #2
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This is actually a bigger problem then some realize. A reputable person in town sold my sister a new plate and mounted them..........IMO with extreme offset.

(pictures coming soon)

That along with going from a lifelong SA laser to DA laser.......needless to say the last couple of months shes been miserable. I am meeting her this weekend to get them and properly mount them along with a SA conversion.

Please if you are new to skating make sure you have someone that has mounted alot of skates for folks. Just because they have a Snyder tool means nothing if they cant use it.
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Old January 18th, 2017, 04:00 AM   #3
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Mine are toe in heel out from the typical centerline people use to mount their skates. They are purpose aligned for the way I skate and the footwork I do on my toes to offer leverage advantages on the weaker pinky toe side of my foot.

Most people who try my skates cannot make them turn either. lol

I would take some fresh pictures, but the skates are at the cobbler getting the tounges fixed (finally). The 2 ply leather on the bottom has come loose from whatever held them as 1 piece, I thought my plate was broken the other day because of how much steering 1 side was doing vs the other, well leaning over that is, the boot was bending well around the plate and changing the leverages on the blade side of the boot where I have a bit more overhang.
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Old January 18th, 2017, 12:11 PM   #4
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hypothetically speaking...if I ordered a pair of skates yesterday and they show up wonky... how would they know of there was a problem and how to fix it?

asking for a friend....
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Old January 18th, 2017, 11:28 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by bigred875 View Post
hypothetically speaking...if I ordered a pair of skates yesterday and they show up wonky... how would they know of there was a problem and how to fix it?

asking for a friend....
Two easy indicators. If you are in your skates and look down at your boots and see the front wheels. If one wheel shows more than the other. A slight difference may be OK but a lot is not good. The boots should be centered between the wheels. Slight meaning maybe 1/8" difference.. or less. The more the difference, the more stress you will have. Now some old speed skaters actually offset their boots toward the inside of the turn to remove stress.
Another indicator is after skating a bit, you stop and stand and relax a little and your boots tilt outward and you have to straighten them to keep the boots flat.
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Old January 21st, 2017, 05:06 PM   #6
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You mean like this^^
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Old January 21st, 2017, 05:08 PM   #7
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You mean like this^^
Can't wait to get my new quads to be built lol
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Old January 21st, 2017, 08:06 PM   #8
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Can't wait to get my new quads to be built lol
Take one skate and take the pic directly over it only. It will make it easier to see. There are several how toos on here on how to lay out your mounting reference points to do correct alignment and mounting. If you set the skate on a table then take a typical tri-square (wal-mart), stand the square end up. Bump the square against the wheel on one side then the other and compare the differences. The measurements from the sole to the outside of the wheels should be the same or very close to it on both sides of the boot. Some people like a small amount of offset. I dont, some plates have offset built into the toe stop to offset the centerline of being mounted on a boot.
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Old January 21st, 2017, 08:37 PM   #9
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Old January 21st, 2017, 08:52 PM   #10
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In my opinion those are off to the outside.
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Old January 21st, 2017, 09:24 PM   #11
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Yep by a good bit,and my plate is also way too big .its a 775 on a 11.5
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Old January 21st, 2017, 10:14 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Rossman76 View Post
Can't wait to get my new quads to be built lol
Its up to what feels comfortable for you
I run my boots 1mm in so the plates are 1mm offset outwards.
so more of my outside wheels would be showing.
I did it in theory first and had no complaints so i do it that way every time.
The theory was that you push outward when you skate and also that your wheels are less likely to interlock with each other.like when you spin from backwards to forward and your left skate gets too close to your right one and the inside wheels interlock and stop ,but you keep going and boom ! ouch face first ,I done it before.
Btw your plates are not too big.
you can move the plate forward and change the offset at the same time.then soften the suspension to get the best of both worlds[ steering and stability]
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Old January 21st, 2017, 10:25 PM   #13
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Yep by a good bit,and my plate is also way too big .its a 775 on a 11.5

Bro, i got a 193mm plate (7.75 is 196mm) on a size 10 vanilla boot plate is fine .

Vanilla freestyle, 276mm last, and a riedell is a 292mm.

Lol just messin with ya. Find where you want you pivot points,(heel and toes) and that's the plate you need.

Edit..

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Its up to what feels comfortable for you
I run my boots 1mm in so the plates are 1mm offset outwards.
so more of my outside wheels would be showing.
I did it in theory first and had no complaints so i do it that way every time.
The theory was that you push outward when you skate and also that your wheels are less likely to interlock with each other.like when you spin from backwards to forward and your left skate gets too close to your right one and the inside wheels interlock and stop ,but you keep going and boom ! ouch face first ,I done it before.
Btw your plates are not too big.
you can move the plate forward and change the offset at the same time.then soften the suspension to get the best of both worlds[ steering and stability]
Mine are setup more like an inline than a quad skate. The center of the plates tip is pointing out of the center of my 2nd toe (pointer toe). My heel is displaced a tiny bit to the outside edge of my feet. Essentially toe in heel out, this helps with top speed since toward the end of the stride and the higher power/footspeed area of the stride, the skate has a bit more lateral push available.

I always recommend the longest plate one can comfortably handle. Suspension and wheel selection will have a huge influence on how turny a plate is. I can make a 700 proline turn just like my arius, its all in the skater.
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Old January 21st, 2017, 11:31 PM   #14
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Yep by a good bit,and my plate is also way too big .its a 775 on a 11.5
I would not have an issue with that length. I like longer frames and tune for better turning.. If you look at my skates, mine are toe in, heel centered. 8 inch axle centers on 46 Eur boots. But if you measure the plates, they are actually centered to the sole of the boots, they just appear to be toe in.
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Old January 21st, 2017, 11:42 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mort View Post
Mine are toe in heel out from the typical centerline people use to mount their skates. They are purpose aligned for the way I skate and the footwork I do on my toes to offer leverage advantages on the weaker pinky toe side of my foot.

Most people who try my skates cannot make them turn either. lol

I would take some fresh pictures, but the skates are at the cobbler getting the tounges fixed (finally). The 2 ply leather on the bottom has come loose from whatever held them as 1 piece, I thought my plate was broken the other day because of how much steering 1 side was doing vs the other, well leaning over that is, the boot was bending well around the plate and changing the leverages on the blade side of the boot where I have a bit more overhang.
I am glad you had that issue as that is exactly the issue I had when the sole started to separate on my boots. The leverage changed considerably but only in one direction. It was enough that I could get a wicked speed wobble. Remember when you said it wasn't caused by the boot. Well that particular style of ( insert Antik AR1 here) has the heel that is not stitched. I could get a 1/4 gap but only on the outside of my right foot. Also with the same set up I felt at warp 9 the front two wheels slid with every stroke when my wheels came back in contact with the floor. At regular speed I didn't notice this front wheel slide back from outside to inside. One night I got the idea that maybe the plate was a few degrees off of my big toe. Got another setup with exactly the same wheelbase and front axel placement but with the front a few degrees toward the big toe. Problem solved and even more speed...
I was also getting the exact same pain in my foot that the OP described. I thought it was just age.. nope. Plate placement matched to the anatomy or more specifically the bio-mechanics of how one skates is the key.
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Old January 22nd, 2017, 01:00 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mort View Post
Bro, i got a 193mm plate (7.75 is 196mm) on a size 10 vanilla boot plate is fine .

Vanilla freestyle, 276mm last, and a riedell is a 292mm.

Lol just messin with ya. Find where you want you pivot points,(heel and toes) and that's the plate you need.

Edit..



Mine are setup more like an inline than a quad skate. The center of the plates tip is pointing out of the center of my 2nd toe (pointer toe). My heel is displaced a tiny bit to the outside edge of my feet. Essentially toe in heel out, this helps with top speed since toward the end of the stride and the higher power/footspeed area of the stride, the skate has a bit more lateral push available.

I always recommend the longest plate one can comfortably handle. Suspension and wheel selection will have a huge influence on how turny a plate is. I can make a 700 proline turn just like my arius, its all in the skater.
Yeah I guess it boils down to personal preference.when I was younger I skated a very short forward setup that was dead straight.i suppose that somehow I still have some muscle memory left and the wheels bite in weird circumstances and it messes with me a little .not much agility at all.i am however going to go with some of the softest cushions for now until I switch things up.
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Old January 22nd, 2017, 01:24 PM   #17
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I am glad you had that issue as that is exactly the issue I had when the sole started to separate on my boots. The leverage changed considerably but only in one direction. It was enough that I could get a wicked speed wobble. Remember when you said it wasn't caused by the boot. Well that particular style of ( insert Antik AR1 here) has the heel that is not stitched. I could get a 1/4 gap but only on the outside of my right foot. Also with the same set up I felt at warp 9 the front two wheels slid with every stroke when my wheels came back in contact with the floor. At regular speed I didn't notice this front wheel slide back from outside to inside. One night I got the idea that maybe the plate was a few degrees off of my big toe. Got another setup with exactly the same wheelbase and front axel placement but with the front a few degrees toward the big toe. Problem solved and even more speed...
I was also getting the exact same pain in my foot that the OP described. I thought it was just age.. nope. Plate placement matched to the anatomy or more specifically the bio-mechanics of how one skates is the key.
Not holding traction at the beginning and end of the stroke can be from suspension that is not flexible enough(not saying loose) or not binding at part of the stroke. Loose and flexible are not quite the same. My suspension gives all the way to the end of the stroke to promote traction, if there is binding, the wheels break loose early. A loose suspension(trucks flopping) will do the same and hold traction but I never felt in as good of control setting up my trucks like that.
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Old January 24th, 2017, 02:37 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mort View Post
Bro, i got a 193mm plate (7.75 is 196mm) on a size 10 vanilla boot plate is fine .
I don't OWN a 7.75" plate, and I wear a 13.

It's 6.85" - 7.125 for me. But I'm funny that way.

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I always recommend the longest plate one can comfortably handle.
I always recommend the shortest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mort View Post
I can make a 700 proline turn just like my arius, its all in the skater.
As long as your plates are, I suspect that's true.
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Old January 24th, 2017, 06:27 PM   #19
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I don't OWN a 7.75" plate, and I wear a 13.

It's 6.85" - 7.125 for me. But I'm funny that way.
WEIRDO!


I always recommend the shortest.
I look at it this way (for me at least) why run a shorter plate when it offers you nothing?


As long as your plates are, I suspect that's true.
Only plate I couldnt make turn like I wanted was an old crappy Labeda G80 skate, but the cushions were rock hard and cranked all the way down.

It doesnt matter whats on my feet tho.
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Old January 24th, 2017, 10:25 PM   #20
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Well there is a correct way to mount plates, vs "alternate" ways that aren't correct.


How to Center Roller Skate Plates
by Dave VanBelleghem


Information about the best way to center quad roller skate plates including the differences in aligning plates and frames for quad, inline, and ice skates.

Probably nothing can make learning to quad skate more difficult than having your plates not centered properly. I've seen pairs of skates with one plate pointing at the little toe and the mate pointing at the big toe. Imagine what fun you would have trying to skate in a straight line.

Many quad plates are mounted with the centerline of the plate following the "geometrical" centerline of the foot. This is the typical setup for ice and inline skates. While this may allow you to glide in a straight line on one foot on your quads you will notice when you look down that the front wheel on the inside of your foot sticks way out while the outside wheel hardly shows. For better balance and to transmit your leg power through the wheels more efficiently the centerline of the plate should point slightly to the outside edge of the skate boot. The amount of front wheel sticking out from either side of the boot will be closer to being equal. A good rule of thumb is to have the plate centerline pointing at the gap between the second toe (the long one next to the big toe) and the third toe (the one to the outside of the second toe).


You can determine this position by putting on the boot before mounting and marking the spot with a piece of chalk. Run the chalk mark around to the sole. Use a centerpunch to make a little dimple on the bottom of the boot at this point and make another centerpunch mark at the back of the heel. You now have your reference points for centering the plate. Refer to the article on plate location for determining where to mount the plate on the centerline.

What are some of the reasons for centering the plates in this fashion.

Your weight is more evenly distributed across your wheels.

Sharp turns are much easier to handle.

As you are skating your front gliding foot will curve gradually to the outside, allowing for a more efficient skating movement and transmitting of power from your legs. Watch a speed skating race sometime (ice, inline or quad). This is the technique they use.
Copyright Dave VanBelleghem

Last edited by ursle; June 4th, 2018 at 12:12 PM.
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