Roll Line Dance Plate on a size 11 Riedell 297 boot - Can it be done?

[sk84luv]

Originally Posted by larryoracing

If you saw a standard mount for a Riedell boot the plate would actually go to the tip of the boot. From your diagram the plate stops short of the tip of the boot. So really this is a non-standard mount for a Riedell boot and more of a artistic mount common to most of the advanced skaters on this website.

I wonder if the 190 plate what was recommended for your size 11 boots?

Thanks,

Larry Otani


Have a great day!

Larry, I don't know where you got your info., but I have a Mistral 170 purchased from skatesUS, and recommended by them to mate with my Reidell Tribute boots, size 8 1/2. The 170, axle to axle is longer by 1/8" than the Sure Grip Classic I have on my Reidell 297B professionals, size 8 1/2. All Reidell artistic boots are built on the identical last. A longer Mistral on my 336 Tribute would make my skates less maneuverable.

Clearly, the end of the mistral on the Reidell falls short by nearly the width of my pinkie finger, while the back of the plate is flush.The mount looks identical to the way it's pictured in the Roll-Line mounting instruction chart.

[larryoracing]

What size Mistral plate is recommended by the "charts" for a Riedell size 11, 297 Boots.

Thankyou,

Larry Otani

P.S, I decided to go online and look at the charts myself.

Here's the link:

https://sep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-99805...3_2267_8769930

The Charts says you can mount a Roll Line plate on a Riedell 11 boot anywhere from 180-195. 180 for short/artistic mount to a traditional 195 longer/standard mount.

[rwsz]

netplaceus that is a good pic of a proper mount for artistic skating with a reidell boot or any boot. I hope that most see that the top of the boot where the stitches are is not really the center. its based off the bottom of the boot.

also ridell boots tend to have larger soles then many of the other newer boots out there, I think one of the reasons for the charts to be different.

[larryoracing]

I think David eluded to it. I think one reason for the longer plates suggested for Riedell Boots is a liability issue. Whenever a rink sells a pair of boots or plates they want to insure the skater does not hurt themselves, so they suggest a longer plate than necessary to insure the skater will have a safer skate.

Since Riedell has been in the market longer than any other boot manufacturer and catering to skating rinks I think they wanted to insure for their customers a safe length of plate for their beginner skaters. Hence why I feel they push for the longer plate for their Riedell boots.

2) Another point brought up by David is that it is really hard to determine what skate to buy. In general for Roll Line skates, their are three plates you will see in competition. Ghiotto for figures. Dance for Dance Competition and Energy for Freestyle.

2a) So, what skate do you suggest for the average common rink skater. I think the answer is the Energy. I think you would agree. The other two skates are specialty skates and the Energy can be used and is used in all three disciplines.


3) Finally from the charts given how to you decide which plate to recommend. I think everybody evaluates each skater on a Case By Case Basis.

For the Roll Line Plate on the Riedell boot you have four choices for a size 11 boot. Whether it be US Skates, Your Family Rink owner, your pro, your friend of even people on this internet you have to evaluate the skater, his abilities and skills and suggest one of the 4 different plates, in this particular case. That is why we have so many different opinions on which plate to recommend for a certain size Riedell Boot.

I think the bottom line is we all want to help the prospective buyer into making the right choice plate length and hopefully getting that person into the right skate plate for that person's skating. I think most people think long and hard before suggesting a person buy one particular plate length or plate type over another. It could be a very expensive mistake and people make the wrong boot and skate plate purchases all the time. It's very expensive and embarrassing.

Sincerely,

Larry O and hope all have a great day skating!


P.S. I skate on the Dance Plate everyday, but I would not recommend it for most, because I don't think they would like it. In the end it's their investment their skating and their choice.

[netplaceus]

Originally Posted by rwsz

netplaceus that is a good pic of a proper mount for artistic skating with a reidell boot or any boot. I hope that most see that the top of the boot where the stitches are is not really the center. its based off the bottom of the boot.

also ridell boots tend to have larger soles then many of the other newer boots out there, I think one of the reasons for the charts to be different.

Very good points and in my experience 100% dead on correct!

"ridell boots tend to have larger soles then many of the other newer boots out there"

I agree completely, as for as I am concerned the mystery is solved.

[netplaceus]

Originally Posted by larryoracing

What size Mistral plate is recommended by the "charts" for a Riedell size 11, 297 Boots.

Thankyou,

Larry Otani

P.S, I decided to go online and look at the charts myself.

Here's the link:

https://sep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-99805...3_2267_8769930

The Charts says you can mount a Roll Line plate on a Riedell 11 boot anywhere from 180-195. 180 for short/artistic mount to a traditional 195 longer/standard mount.

Larry, you are by far the king of useless, gibberish, nonsensical, wrong advice! That link is a snip of the real chart, it's showing half size frames! The Dance Plate is not available in half frames.


I like to keep things friendly, we all have our opinions. However, I find myself feeling similar to ursle, I am no longer interested in your advice. You love to hand out advice to everyone about everything and anything. But in my opinion almost nothing you post has much depth to it, is off topic or unwanted or just some nonsense copied off the internet. You appear to have very little real life experience, and few things you have said have not changed that perception for me. I don’t find you helpful, just annoying. So if I don’t speak up you will just continue to be annoying.
My advice to you is to stop spewing advice and ideas in mass quantities. Set your ego aside, and if you disagree with something ask sincere questions sometimes. At least consider the possibility the person you are talking to (I don’t mean me) may be vastly more experienced then you because they work in the business or may be competing on a national level or are just plane more experienced then you. There are LOTS of things I am not qualified to advise on here, and to do so would be nothing more than a poser. Go for quality and not quantity. PLEASE do not ask me any more questions or send me more advice, I have zero interest in your comments. My only other choice was just to ignore you. Others can do as they wish!

Below is the current standard chart used in the industry. The reason the industry has a “standard mount” is because charts like this could not exists without it. It’s is a reference and sizing point. The Roll-Line mount picture I posted is a standard mount or about 1mm inside the end of the heel. Obviously translated from Italian, you don’t need a “hammer”! Whenever possible go directly to the Riedell, Roll-Line, etc. for information. They have lots of PDF’s they are more than happy to send you in addition to what is on-line.

[amohrfeld]

Originally Posted by netplaceus

The Roll-Line mount is about 1mm inside the end of the heel.

This is somewhat misleading. My Edea heel end is .145" (3.7mm) further forward than my Riedell.

It is impossible for the plate manufacture to know which boot is used. So the installer must be knowledgeable.

The more I experiment with mount positions the more confused I become.

[larryoracing]

Wasn't really trying to do that. I think many people learned from the post.

Sincerely,

Larry Otani

P.S. Hopefully you got all the info you needed but I think Amohrfeld said it all. The more you learn the more you don't know. It gets confusing but I think all the information presented helped. Good Luck in your skating.

[netplaceus]

Originally Posted by amohrfeld

This is somewhat misleading. My Edea heel end is .145" (3.7mm) further forward than my Riedell.

It is impossible for the plate manufacture to know which boot is used. So the installer must be knowledgeable.

The more I experiment with mount positions the more confused I become.

"This is somewhat misleading. My Edea heel end is .145" (3.7mm) further forward than my Riedell."

Note the small print at the bottom of the chart? It's there for the reason you just noted.

"It is impossible for the plate manufacture to know which boot is used. So the installer must be knowledgeable."

Ha! Yes, but I sure would not count on it! If you have the skills do it yourself. Some places do a great job, others suck at it. The thing is most of the people that have their skates done by someone else don't know anything about it. So if they suck, it often goes unnoticed. It's sad, but most pro shops don't have much in the way of shop equipment. I had to go to an Ice arena to get my 297's in for an oven fitting. Time is money, you don't know their situation, the snackbar kid may be doing your $800.00 Edea's between ring-ups.

"The more I experiment with mount positions the more confused I become."

Yes, and I can tell you why you're are confused: How a Short/Forward, longer or shorter plates affect skating technically is well understood. It's just physics. Many skaters use this knowledge to help with their particular style of skating, no surprise. One thing for sure, the mount is unlikely to make everything better. So if it makes the important stuff better for you and you can compensate for the rest you may have a winner. So it's always a trade off of pros and cons, and the outcome (how it feels) will be a little different for everyone.

How does it feel to you? Unlike having the correct boot size or axle nuts, etc. you have left the world of finite variables and are deep into the infinite and every changing world of you! A HUGE, unpredictable, unmeasurable variable.
I don't mean to be overly sentimental, but this is why I think skating is really exciting and rewarding. WHAT CAN YOU DO WITH WHAT YOU'VE GOT!

You don't know, nobody does. So you try new things, be confused, make lots of mistakes, do your best to beat yesterday. You're in uncharted territory man, boldly go where no skater has gone before!

[netplaceus]

Originally Posted by larryoracing

Wasn't really trying to do that. I think many people learned from the post.

Sincerely,

Larry Otani

P.S. Hopefully you got all the info you needed but I think Amohrfeld said it all. The more you learn the more you don't know. It gets confusing but I think all the information presented helped. Good Luck in your skating.

Larry , it's cool. You are a very friendly guy, you sometimes drive a few of us nuts, but you are still a very friendly guy, and that's a good thing.

However, if you send me any more questions or advice on this post I will go insane, skate off a freeway bridge, and make a big mess creating a bad name for skaters everywhere. So be good!

[netplaceus]

Originally Posted by rwsz

my son use to be a world class singles skater and had an rolline energy 185 on an 11 riedell 297 and then a little custom 330 or something like that I think and its fine. if u find the plate a bit small u can always put it a bit forward on the heel as getting it under the ball of the foot is more important. I mounted plenty of riedell boots back in the day

Wow, that is so cool, skating tallent really runs in your family!

I'm never going to be a world class skater, but I love hearing someone with my larger foot size having done so well. Always though my feet were too big, but just have to work a little harder for some things as with my height.

[larryoracing]

on an open forum. A lot a people have learned from your post and not everybody is going to agree with you. I think it goes along with the passive aggressive idea, which you are starting to take.

Take care!

Larry O

[netplaceus]

Originally Posted by larryoracing

on an open forum. A lot a people have learned from your post and not everybody is going to agree with you. I think it goes along with the passive aggressive idea, which you are starting to take.

Take care!

Larry O

I could care less if people agree with me. This was about you spamming myself and others with unwanted questions and advice and being disruptive. This has nothing to do with passive aggressive anything. You just don't know when to stop and likely never will. You are the ONLY one I have a problem with on this forum, just you.

I was just trying to find a way bury the hatchet so to speak, nothing else was met by that message. Nothing!

You are the very definition of an Internet troll. And the best way to handle
trolls is to ignore them. I can't stop you from spamming me with gibberish advice and questions on my posts but I can ignore you for my sanity and
peace of mind. So you now know contact with me is unwelcome, if you continue to force communication with me in any way you are a troll.

I will never again quote you, advise you, or otherwise reference your name and I request you do the same for me. And you know I find you irritating as hell, so why would I want your advice or questions on any of my posts?

So unless you continue to troll me, we're done forever. It's is as simple as that. Problem gone.

To troll or not to troll, it's up to you.

[SSpinball]

late to the conversation, I am a lifetime skater nearly 60.
I have been skating the Dance since it first came out. about 4 years ago ?
and am extremely happy with my purchase, even considering the price.
love the dance plate, and the control it delivers. highly recommend !

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0Bw...Ul5OXMxNE5PWUE

[netplaceus]

Originally Posted by SSpinball

late to the conversation, I am a lifetime skater nearly 60.
I have been skating the Dance since it first came out. about 4 years ago ?
and am extremely happy with my purchase, even considering the price.
love the dance plate, and the control it delivers. highly recommend !

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0Bw...Ul5OXMxNE5PWUE

Thanks for that awesome picture! Roll-Line Dance, Rapido's wheels, Edea FLY Boot -Dream saktes!

[SSpinball]

my "Dream skates",
exactly right, I got a nice bonus 1 year, and was due for new skates.
love the combination, minus those big ugly toe stops,
I took those off before hitting the floor, replaced with some small stops.

[dvw]

Originally Posted by amohrfeld

This is somewhat misleading. My Edea heel end is .145" (3.7mm) further forward than my Riedell.

The shape and dimensions of the sole on a Riedell, Edea and Harlick are very different. To somehow use them as the basis for what size plate to use is misleading at best. "The chart" is and always has been a jumping off point.

Originally Posted by amohrfeld

It is impossible for the plate manufacture to know which boot is used. So the installer must be knowledgeable.

Bingo.

You can certainly build a skate by the numbers. The difference between good skates and great skates comes from knowing where to get the numbers. Building skates well borders on black art.

Originally Posted by amohrfeld

The more I experiment with mount positions the more confused I become.

The more skates I build the more I learn. I have about 19 pairs of my own and parts to build half a dozen or so more. No two of them skate the same. I like peanut butter and jelly, but I don't eat it every single meal.

[netplaceus]

Originally Posted by dvw

The shape and dimensions of the sole on a Riedell, Edea and Harlick are very different. To somehow use them as the basis for what size plate to use is misleading at best. "The chart" is and always has been a jumping off point.



Bingo.

You can certainly build a skate by the numbers. The difference between good skates and great skates comes from knowing where to get the numbers. Building skates well borders on black art.



The more skates I build the more I learn. I have about 19 pairs of my own and parts to build half a dozen or so more. No two of them skate the same. I like peanut butter and jelly, but I don't eat it every single meal.

It would seem there is an experimenter personality. I know many who have skated for 10 years or more and have no interest trying a different cushion or plate, etc, and that's cool.

Others only a few years and have already skated with many configurations under vastly different conditions.

I have always been an indoor skater, but recently discovered skate parks.
Funny, I used to carefully step down onto the rink floor to enter it. Now I often just skate off the carpet and drop in as long as it's is clear. And I can stop faster than I used to. The parks really changed me. Of course this is all old news to someone who's in roller derby. I can't imagine what that would do to me or if I could stay standing long enough to learn anything!

Your comments have inspired me. Eventually I am going to build a pair of skates around the dance plate. That will only make 3 pairs for me, but it is a start. Peanut butter and jelly is good, but I learned I like to mix it up.

[dvw]

Originally Posted by netplaceus

It would seem there is an experimenter personality.

More of a student actually. I like to know why things behave like they do.

Originally Posted by netplaceus

I know many who have skated for 10 years or more and have no interest trying a different cushion or plate, etc, and that's cool.

And that's fine. People used to be happy thinking the world was flat too.

Originally Posted by netplaceus

Your comments have inspired me. Eventually I am going to build a pair of skates around the dance plate. That will only make 3 pairs for me, but it is a start. Peanut butter and jelly is good, but I learned I like to mix it up.

You won't ever know what prime rib tastes like until you take a bite.