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Old January 30th, 2018, 12:18 AM   #21
fierocious1
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Originally Posted by netplaceus View Post
"I have recommended people not to buy the Dance Roll Line plate and they are really happy with the decision."

Oh for Pete's sakes, that is just silly! It's like saying I recommended people not try or buy the XX pizza or YY beer and that they were all happy with their decision.

It not that black & white in reality. It is much like cushions, some like them really soft and some hard for the same kind of skating. Then there are those that never try a different cushion or worse just follow the stupid weight charts. Over time those who never experiment will never know what works best for them.

My hats off to those who understand there are few hard rules when it comes to plates, cushions and wheels. Anyway you look at it the SKATER is
a HUGE unmeasurable factor at what he or she can do with their hardware.

" A Roll Line Dance Plate was designed to cut deep edges doing Artistic Dance."

True, but if you do your homework you will see people are using it for Figure & Rhythm too. There is also interest in Freestyle, Jam, Speed, Derby & Hockey!


" My question is why do people buy plates that they should not be buying"

Sorry, this is just a little arrogant, don't you think?
I would not say that Larry O is arrogant, he has a LOT of skate building experience. It is up to the person to weigh the advice and take it or not. I have a friend in Houston that had a setup built by Doc Skate, she loves the way they work and recently asked about upgrading parts on the skates,but not the skates themselves. She has had them for 5 or 6 years. If you get info from him it is usually very reliable.
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Old January 30th, 2018, 02:12 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing View Post
I don't know to much about the Mistral plate, but a couple of people skate on them and like them.

I also don't know much about the 336 boot, but a couple people skate on them and like them. For some people they felt the 336 was too stiff. This was a beginner skater and a National Champion skater, so maybe the 336 might be too stiff for you. Remember this is the top of the line Dance Boot from Riedel, so it makes sense it is a stiffer boot. The 297 is the accepted standard.

Here's an ideal that really might make some good sense, but it might mean you might have to make a change in plate length in the future. I thought the last time I inquired a year ago the "EXTRA" cost from Riedell for a pair of custom boots is 200 dollars (in addition to the original cost of the boots). What they do is measure each foot 7 different ways and custom tailor a boot for each foot. Nothing will give you better bang for your buck than a pair of custom made boots.

After getting a pair of custom made boots you will need to go to a shorter plate for optimum performance. Upgrade to the Energy plate.

sincerely,

Larry Otani and good luck!

Yes those are some good ideas indeed. I think for now I am going to stay with what I have. I like to try new things, but it just too much money. I think the dance plate is way overpriced right now anyway. I guess because it is new and for now they can get away with it.
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Old January 30th, 2018, 02:25 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by netplaceus View Post
Yes those are some good ideas indeed. I think for now I am going to stay with what I have. I like to try new things, but it just too much money. I think the dance plate is way overpriced right now anyway. I guess because it is new and for now they can get away with it.
I could never afford high end plates to start with... Now I just don't worry about it at all. I just work on what I have and keep making changes, over time it pays off.
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Old January 30th, 2018, 02:52 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by fierocious1 View Post
I would not say that Doc is arrogant, he has a LOT of skate building experience and works with manufacturers. It is up to the person to weigh the advice and take it or not. I have a friend in Houston that had a setup built by Doc, she loves the way they work and recently asked about upgrading parts on the skates,but not the skates themselves. She has had them for 5 or 6 years
I can see that now and agree, I wish I said ornery. I am ornery too, so it all balances out
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Old January 30th, 2018, 03:00 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by fierocious1 View Post
I could never afford high end plates to start with... Now I just don't worry about it at all. I just work on what I have and keep making changes, over time it pays off.
That's a good way to go. I would be the first to admit there is probably little bang for your buck in them.
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Old January 30th, 2018, 11:00 AM   #26
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Smile Netplaceus, your setup is far from cheap.

It would be considered high-end except for maybe the plates.
297 boots are not cheap. The wheels are top of the line and the Mistral plate I gather is right in the middle when considering spending big dollar for plates.

50 percent of the "session" skaters hate the Dance Plate or Imperial and the other half seem to like them. Most people just want a stable platform they can count on...i.e. a plate like the Energy.

The only plate I would recommend to anybody considering the Dance plate, would be to push them towards the Roll Line "Ring" plate, which you cannot buy anymore.

If a pair ever comes on the market that is your size, buy them and you will probably love them. At first glance they look like a Dance plate. Basically they are, but the truck action has been toned down enormously, but has a lot more wobble than normal for those who want to step out of the "Box". I highly recommend this plate. It's a great plate for the amateur and professional alike.


Good luck and buy some Bones Ceramic bearings.

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Old January 30th, 2018, 12:23 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing;
"I have recommended people not to buy the Dance Roll Line plate and they are really happy with the decision."
Quote:
Originally Posted by netplaceus;
Oh for Pete's sakes, that is just silly! It's like saying I recommended people not try or buy the XX pizza or YY beer and that they were all happy with their decision.

It not that black & white in reality. It is much like cushions, some like them really soft and some hard for the same kind of skating. Then there are those that never try a different cushion or worse just follow the stupid weight charts. Over time those who never experiment will never know what works best for them.

My hats off to those who understand there are few hard rules when it comes to plates, cushions and wheels. Anyway you look at it the SKATER is
a HUGE unmeasurable factor at what he or she can do with their hardware.
Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing;
" A Roll Line Dance Plate was designed to cut deep edges doing Artistic Dance."
Quote:
Originally Posted by netplaceus;
True, but if you do your homework you will see people are using it for Figure & Rhythm too. There is also interest in Freestyle, Jam, Speed, Derby & Hockey!

Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing;
" My question is why do people buy plates that they should not be buying"
Quote:
Originally Posted by netplaceus;
Sorry, this is just a little arrogant, don't you think?
Quote:
Originally Posted by fierocious1 View Post
I would not say that Doc is arrogant, he has a LOT of skate building experience and works with manufacturers. It is up to the person to weigh the advice and take it or not. I have a friend in Houston that had a setup built by Doc, she loves the way they work and recently asked about upgrading parts on the skates,but not the skates themselves. She has had them for 5 or 6 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by netplaceus View Post
I can see that now and agree, I wish I said ornery. I am ornery too, so it all balances out
So, netplaceus was quoting larryoracing and ferocious somehow attributed doc as larryoracing, doc wasn't in the conversation, if netplaces wants to change arrogant to ornery, fine, but let's not label doc ornery when he's
A-not in the conversation
B-not dissing others

Just lack of comprehension.

Last edited by ursle; January 30th, 2018 at 03:27 PM.
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Old January 30th, 2018, 08:36 PM   #28
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Smile Dear David, Hope we have answered your quesion.

I was thinking about your post and came to the conclusion you had the answer before you even asked the question.

You have a Roll Line Mistral plate mounted to a Riedell 297 boot. What ever the size of the Mistral plate is, is the size plate you should order when you order your Dance plate.

If you have a 180 Mistral plate, order a 180 Dance plate. Done deal end of question. Took me a while to figure out what you were asking...lol!

Now, on a different note, its funny people don't talk about the Roll Line Matrix plate or the Roll Line Evol plate. Seems to me those would be two plates people would like to try way before a Dance Plate????


Next the hottest plate on the market now is the Kinetrics at a cool 650 dollars. If you want to dream, you might consider that plate. One competitor bought a pair. He don't say much and just said "Best Plate I have ever bought" and it is not considered a "Dance" plate and he's won about 20 National titles in Dance and he is using it for Dance Competition.

Thanks for the Post,


Larry Otani
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Old January 30th, 2018, 09:23 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ursle View Post
So, netplaceus was quoting larryoracing and ferocious somehow attributed doc as larryoracing, doc wasn't in the conversation, if netplaces wants to change arrogant to ornery, fine, but let's not label doc ornery when he's
A-not in the conversation
B-not dissing others

Just lack of comprehension.
Yes, it was all a huge misunderstanding! I just assumed "doc" was a nickname you all gave to larryoracing or something.

As for my comment to larryoracing, it was never intended to be mean or malicious. It was met to be playfully frank, but with only text and smileys it's hard to pull off. You have my most sincere apologies. For the record no one is arrogant and no one is ornery. Well, I'm ornery, but I'm cool with it.

My guess is larryoracing did not even blink, took no offence. I'd insert a peace icon, but I don't see one listed. Forums should have those.
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Old January 30th, 2018, 10:07 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing View Post
I was thinking about your post and came to the conclusion you had the answer before you even asked the question.

You have a Roll Line Mistral plate mounted to a Riedell 297 boot. What ever the size of the Mistral plate is, is the size plate you should order when you order your Dance plate.

If you have a 180 Mistral plate, order a 180 Dance plate. Done deal end of question. Took me a while to figure out what you were asking...lol!

Now, on a different note, its funny people don't talk about the Roll Line Matrix plate or the Roll Line Evol plate. Seems to me those would be two plates people would like to try way before a Dance Plate????


Next the hottest plate on the market now is the Kinetrics at a cool 650 dollars. If you want to dream, you might consider that plate. One competitor bought a pair. He don't say much and just said "Best Plate I have ever bought" and it is not considered a "Dance" plate and he's won about 20 National titles in Dance and he is using it for Dance Competition.

Thanks for the Post,


Larry Otani
No worries larry, it's all cool! My Mistral plate is 190, bigger than the largest Roll Line Dance Plate made.

It was a complicated question, I was mostly just curious. I don't have the funds or enough need (Ha! maybe your were right) to be buying expensive plates right now. But yes, I found out what I wanted to know indirectly.

The question: Roll Line Dance Plate on a size 11 Riedell 297 boot - Can it be done?

The answer: Yes, but probably not done well. The Roll Line Dance Plate 180
will not line up right on the size 11 Riedell 297 boot and there is no such thing as a Roll Line Dance Plate 190 (size needed). Email from Roll Line.

Anyway, I'm good, you all can debate it further if you like, I'm moving on. Thank you for all your suggestions!
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Old January 30th, 2018, 11:36 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing View Post
If you have a 180 Mistral plate, order a 180 Dance plate. Done deal end of question. Took me a while to figure out what you were asking...lol!
Buy a 180 if it fits. Not because you already have one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing View Post
Now, on a different note, its funny people don't talk about the Roll Line Matrix plate or the Roll Line Evol plate. Seems to me those would be two plates people would like to try way before a Dance Plate????
Depends on what you want. The Matrix is a $1000 plate that has a goofy little truck arrangement and a low deck height. If you want to be disappointed in four figures, that's your plate.

Essentially, all Roll Lines of a given geometry skate more or less the same, i.e. a Mistral feels like a Variant feels like an Energy. The key difference is the materials the base plate is made from and the amount of machining done to remove weight. The differences are fairly esoteric, and most skaters would not really notice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing View Post
...it is not considered a "Dance" plate and he's won about 20 National titles in Dance and he is using it for Dance Competition.i
That should tell you something. Just because a plate is a "dance plate" or a "figure plate" doesn't mean you can't use it for whatever you want. It's about how the plate feels at the end of your leg, and whether it permits you do skate the way you want.
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Old January 30th, 2018, 11:55 PM   #32
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It probably would not be wise to do it unless one knows why Riedell apparently needs a larger plate then the other boots of the same size.
If you're comparing Riedell to Edea to Harlick, you have to ignore the numbers. An 11 Riedell is nothing like an 11 Harlick. That might be some of the confusion.

Quote:
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"Sure. I skate a 180 on a size 13. 180 on an 11 is a walk in the park."

That is very intriguing!
I think so.


Ultimate Dominator size 9 (6-7/8") on a 300mm Bont


Size 11 (7") Snyder Royal NTS on a size 13 Oberhamer 351


Size 5 Sure Grip XK-4 prototype DA-45 (6.85") on a size 13 Riedell front flap 395


You get the idea.
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Old January 31st, 2018, 12:21 AM   #33
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I can see that now and agree, I wish I said ornery. I am ornery too, so it all balances out
Corrected a mistake above. Larry O has been around here a while. I said Doc instead of Larry O. Doc, DVW and others have very reliable info as well as others on here. My stuff may not apply to your setup at all. But the others info will.
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Old January 31st, 2018, 12:35 AM   #34
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Essentially, all Roll Lines of a given geometry skate more or less the same, i.e. a Mistral feels like a Variant feels like an Energy. The key difference is the materials the base plate is made from and the amount of machining done to remove weight. The differences are fairly esoteric, and most skaters would not really notice.

This is so true! And many of them feel the same because they have the same kingpin angles. I have always found it odd, suspicious, some plate manufacturers avoid talking about or even listing their kingpin angles.
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Last edited by netplaceus; January 31st, 2018 at 06:41 AM.
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Old January 31st, 2018, 12:42 AM   #35
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Corrected a mistake above. Larry O has been around here a while. I said Doc instead of Larry O. Doc, DVW and others have very reliable info as well as others on here. My stuff may not apply to your setup at all. But the others info will.
OK, thanks and no worries. I learn from everybody
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Old January 31st, 2018, 06:43 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by dvw View Post
If you're comparing Riedell to Edea to Harlick, you have to ignore the numbers. An 11 Riedell is nothing like an 11 Harlick. That might be some of the confusion.



I think so.


Ultimate Dominator size 9 (6-7/8") on a 300mm Bont


Size 11 (7") Snyder Royal NTS on a size 13 Oberhamer 351


Size 5 Sure Grip XK-4 prototype DA-45 (6.85") on a size 13 Riedell front flap 395


You get the idea.
Nice! I do, thanks!
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Old January 31st, 2018, 11:00 AM   #37
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Smile Dear David,Sorry we could not help you.

I know your heart was set on buying a pair of 180 Dance Plates and mounting them to your Riedell 297 boots.

The only way I could see you running the 180 Dance plate would be to buy a pair of Berry Boots and mounting them to your 180 plates. Riedell Boots are huge and Edea Boots are smaller, but the smallest boots for your foot size is the Berry Boots.

That's what I run. I run a short 160 Dance Plate with the smallest size 8 Berry Boots. It's the perfect setup and looks perfect and feels great and skates great!

Good luck. And by the way all the negative comments, I don't even hear them. Didn't even know who said them. It's just not important. Try to help people, enjoy skating and spread good cheer!

Larry O
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Old January 31st, 2018, 07:32 PM   #38
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In my opinion Roll Line plates are worth the money. They improve my stability and control.
I have finally determined my preferred plate length and mount position so I am in the process of switching over to Roll Line for my indoor skates.

I'm still skating Snyder for outdoors. Because I already have it and am less concerned if it gets damaged.
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Old January 31st, 2018, 10:25 PM   #39
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I know your heart was set on buying a pair of 180 Dance Plates and mounting them to your Riedell 297 boots.

The only way I could see you running the 180 Dance plate would be to buy a pair of Berry Boots and mounting them to your 180 plates. Riedell Boots are huge and Edea Boots are smaller, but the smallest boots for your foot size is the Berry Boots.

That's what I run. I run a short 160 Dance Plate with the smallest size 8 Berry Boots. It's the perfect setup and looks perfect and feels great and skates great!

Good luck. And by the way all the negative comments, I don't even hear them. Didn't even know who said them. It's just not important. Try to help people, enjoy skating and spread good cheer!

Larry O
Oh I'm good, just curious to see if anyone had done it before. As for the plate it will fit on virtually all the other size 11 boots on the chart. Lots of options! For now, Iím staying put.
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Old January 31st, 2018, 10:27 PM   #40
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Smile Dear Amohrfeld, no Doubt the Dance plate is nice,

But is it the right plate for David? David skates on a traditional Artistic Boot. I got a feeling many posters do not. David's skating on a Mistral and again, I think most people on this internet are not. David is skating on a special medium grip freestyle wheel, by Roll Line, most people are not at least it seems most people are not, who are responding to this post.

So, what David is worried about is spending thousands of dollars on a whim, in which he might not like the final result. Pretty Smart in my opinion.

I think it would be wrong to push David into a 500 dollar mistake.

Now, is there a different avenue which might give him the same result. Maybe a used pair of Synder Imperial skates?

Take Care and thanks for the posting. I learned a lot from you and everybody else. Cheers!


Larry O

P.S. Does anybody know why Douglas Synder designed the Synder Imperial skate? To give you the feeling of doing "Loop" figures on ice.
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