S k a t e L o g     F o r u m
Inline Skating and Quad Roller Skating
Forum Hosts: Jessica Wright | Kathie Fry

FOLLOW US: Our Blog | Facebook | Twitter | Email    


Home - Forum Index - Africa Skating - Asia Skating - Europe Skating - Oceania Skating - Pan America Skating - Roller_Rinks - Friend the SkateLog Forum in Facebook - SkateLog Forum on Facebook

Forum Administrators: Jessica Wright and Kathie Fry | Email Us
Access code for buying and selling subforums: "skates"
How To Get a User Account and Posting Privileges in the SkateLog Forum
Use Google to Search the SkateLog Forum

Go Back   SkateLog Forum > Special Interest Skating Forums (sorted by number of posts) > Roller Derby Forum
FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Roller Derby Forum Discussions about banked-track and flat-track roller derby events, teams, skaters, and training methods.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old June 30th, 2014, 05:04 PM   #1
RollerMouse
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: By the Bayou where mosquito's love to snack on me
Posts: 11
Default Petite Fresh Meat needing help with skates

I'm 5' 2" & 95lbs and I have small, skinny feet and weird toes (they don't extend completely) and am trying to figure what skate to buy to be more comfortable and not fighting against my skates. I have been skating in Pacer Fandangos for the last few months and I am getting to the point of serious frustration during practices and pain from foot cramps and ankle rubbing. I know all of this is not completely the fault of my skates, I am physically starting from zero because of health problems and I have done very little physical activity for nearly a decade. So this is pushing myself way out of my comfort zone pretty fast. But I really enjoy it so I want to keep going as best I can. And I don't see much second hand stuff in my size.

My budget is around $200 - 300 at most for complete skate. But cheapest route would be best. The Rebel skates have been recommended to me both just regular probe plates or with the Avenger upgrade. I am also trying to avoid a lot of breaking in time as well, if possible. I have read on here too about build with soccer shoes etc. And I am not in a huge rush as I will be visiting NYC soon and hope to stop by Five Stride while I am there. And I have some wheels already that one of the girls from my leave gave me.

Thanx in advance =)
RollerMouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 30th, 2014, 10:23 PM   #2
Armadillo
Senior Member
 
Armadillo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Chicago, Near the Lake
Posts: 6,537
Default

What foot size are you, and what wheel base (axle-to-axle centers) are you currently rolling?

I would suggest you go with a SG Nova plate upgraded to titanium Kingpins. They come with 7mm axle aluminum trucks (which can be upgraded to titanium as well), but if you have a big investment in 8mm bearing wheel sets, then the Nova plate might not be the best choice. The Bont Ignite would make a good alternative and it comes with 8mm axle option.

Clearly your skates do not turn easily enough, and the suspensions need to be better optimized for freer turning, in order to reduce the foot and ankle stress you are experiencing.

-Armadillo
__________________
Rollin' on AIR
Armadillo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 30th, 2014, 10:42 PM   #3
llama of death
DIY nutter/Gearhead
 
llama of death's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Washington State (eastern)
Posts: 336
Default

Sounds more like a boot fit problem.

Weight is not going to cause rubbing and there is no need for a beginner to use any fancy cusion setups or new plates even to get more turning. Learn to use what you have then bet a better plate.

That said the boot is almost definitely the problem. If you have hammer toes then you may need a boot which can be molded to be "higher". (I also have this issue) Bonts and Jacksons are not out of your range and most shops will mount your old plate to it for little cost.

If you want to upgrade the plate as well your next marked improvement will be on upgraded pilot plate or the Apollo. Though from a pacer even a Sunlite, Rock, or Ignite will be an improvement.

My personal recommendation, intro level Bont package skate. It is heat mold-able which can solve a lot of fit issues and the whole thing is solid and light because it is made to work all as one structure. (Bont hybrid package example)
__________________
'A Ferrari won't make you a Grand Prix driver, but a pinto won't even get you to the finish line.' - unknown
llama of death is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 1st, 2014, 12:20 AM   #4
Armadillo
Senior Member
 
Armadillo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Chicago, Near the Lake
Posts: 6,537
Default

I did not say weight was causing any of the problems, but if she is investing in new skates, then @95 Lbs. why not go for the lightest affordable plates within budget?

I did not say that the current boot should be used for the new skates, only that a Nova or Ignite (we agree) would make a good plate choice.

I did not say to use any fancy cushion setup either, just a good free turning one that demands minimum foot strength to work the full range.

She said she knows she is fighting her skates. Pain and foot cramps can easily be from either choked suspensions or bad fitting boots (or both combined).

The Bont toebox design could help with the toes situation, but narrow feet and Bont are not always such a good match.

-Armadillo
__________________
Rollin' on AIR
Armadillo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 1st, 2014, 12:37 AM   #5
llama of death
DIY nutter/Gearhead
 
llama of death's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Washington State (eastern)
Posts: 336
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Armadillo View Post
narrow feet and Bont are not always such a good match.
-Armadillo
Good point, I have heard that.

Jackson makes decent heat moldable boot in a much narrower last if the bont is too wide. Most come mounted to a Nylon pilot plate for around 250-300. A decent intermediate level skate.
__________________
'A Ferrari won't make you a Grand Prix driver, but a pinto won't even get you to the finish line.' - unknown
llama of death is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 1st, 2014, 01:02 AM   #6
Fancy-Kerrigan
Senior Member
 
Fancy-Kerrigan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Madison, FL
Posts: 758
Default

wow....were to start.
The Bont package skates while cheap, are about equal in quality to an R3. Not great for regular derby usage. I love my Bont, but would recommend something other than their entry level boot for derby usage. Look on ebay for a used boot...even if it's attached to a plate. Pick up a quality leather Riedell boot, if you are as small as you say you are you should have no problem finding a boot in your size. Just keep in mind that they come in men's sizes and bid. accordingly.
As far as the plate, I'd recommend the Avenger plate for several reasons: 1. it's not very expensive. 2. The angle of the trucks takes less effort to turn it. Great for lightweights. While I'm not a fan of the look of the thing, i know many derby girls who love them.
I always recommend putting your effort into finding the best plate your money can buy, and upgrading the boot when you can find the money.
Fancy-Kerrigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 1st, 2014, 05:56 AM   #7
dvw
Secretary of Skate
 
dvw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Hendersonville, TN
Posts: 4,342
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RollerMouse View Post
I have been skating in Pacer Fandangos for the last few months and I am getting to the point of serious frustration during practices and pain from foot cramps and ankle rubbing.
First thing I'd do while skate shopping is to get some softer cushions for your Fandangos. I'm pretty sure the Sure Grip urethanes will fit. At your size, I'd start with the yellow ones, or maybe a yellow top/blue bottom.

The Pacer plates come with three different cushions: hard, hard and hard. Those are a great source of frustration especially on a plastic plate, as the plate will likely flex before the cushions do. That will contribute to poor performance, sore feet, blistered ankles and gobs of frustration.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RollerMouse View Post
My budget is around $200 - 300 at most for complete skate.
Rebel Avenger. The boot is comfortable and durable, and will last you a while, but might be a tick wide if you have skinny feet. The plate will last you a lifetime, and the wheels are well above average for a package skate. They're built mildly short forward, which won't do you any harm at all.

Vanilla Renegade might fit you better, and with an Avenger AL and the wheels you have fits your budget.
__________________
Find some roller derby girls. Don't try to romance them! That don't end well. okie 10/12/2011
Royals FTW! When only the shiny will do... Doc Sk8 05/19/2012
dvw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 1st, 2014, 06:39 AM   #8
RollerMouse
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: By the Bayou where mosquito's love to snack on me
Posts: 11
Default

Wow, so many things!

I am a size 4 - 6 in shoes depending on the type of shoe and if it is adults or kids style. I measured and my feet are about 9". Im wearing a size 4 skate now and it is comfortable for just leisurely skating. I put Hyper Rollo wheels on and skate outdoors. I have a few sets of wheels now with 8mm bearings, is there a reason why 7mm would be better?

I measured about 6" between axles.

I definitely am dealing with fighting my skates in both ways. They are rythym style skates with a stiff tall boot which is nice when I try to skate outside but not great for trying to move sharp and fast. For derby practice I don't lace up all the way and its still rubs my ankle bones and my feet slide inside and it feels like my right foot is being crushed on the turns. I also am still in the stages of slowly loosening my trucks, so maybe its time for another turn looser.

I noticed on the Five Stride that they have Skins DA45 plates, are those a good option? I am looking into trying to get a Magnesium one used. Once I have all the parts do I just take them to a shop and have them assemble it? Nearest one to me is 2hrs away in Houston. I am going to be on a mission to try on as many boots as possible, I cant really afford to not be really sure. I also have seen some old threads about mounting soccer shoes, is that an option? I can easily go try on lots of those.

Last edited by RollerMouse; July 1st, 2014 at 06:28 PM.
RollerMouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 1st, 2014, 07:01 AM   #9
RollerMouse
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: By the Bayou where mosquito's love to snack on me
Posts: 11
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dvw View Post
First thing I'd do while skate shopping is to get some softer cushions for your Fandangos. I'm pretty sure the Sure Grip urethanes will fit. At your size, I'd start with the yellow ones, or maybe a yellow top/blue bottom.

The Pacer plates come with three different cushions: hard, hard and hard. Those are a great source of frustration especially on a plastic plate, as the plate will likely flex before the cushions do. That will contribute to poor performance, sore feet, blistered ankles and gobs of frustration.



Rebel Avenger. The boot is comfortable and durable, and will last you a while, but might be a tick wide if you have skinny feet. The plate will last you a lifetime, and the wheels are well above average for a package skate. They're built mildly short forward, which won't do you any harm at all.

Vanilla Renegade might fit you better, and with an Avenger AL and the wheels you have fits your budget.
I will look into getting a tune up while on my trip to NYC.

So is there much to really be concerned about in the difference in weight between the aluminum and Magnesium versions of the avenger?

I was curious about the Renegade and Vanilla straight jacket because of all the straps but am a bit concerned about such a low boot. Its not something I have ever skated in. I don't know if I would like it or not.
RollerMouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 2nd, 2014, 01:40 AM   #10
rufusprime99
Ninja Naked Mole Rat
 
rufusprime99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: L.A., Ca
Posts: 5,874
Default

With 2 odd things about your feet, narrow and short toes, I would put ALL of you available budget into a properly fitted Bont Quad Racer. Proper boot fit is the number one thing you need. Try contacting Barbie Bont, is that her username here.

As for the rest of the skate, scavenge a plate and wheels from your current skate. Or get a simple SG probe plate for the Bonts. You will have nothing but pain and frustration with boots that do not fit.

Edit: OR….. work with dvw. He is a stand up guy and very knowledgable.
__________________
Don't let people live in your head rent free. ~princessfluffhead~ BontQRL/InvaderDA45: Seba-FRX: Alkali CA9

Last edited by rufusprime99; July 2nd, 2014 at 05:08 AM.
rufusprime99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 2nd, 2014, 04:41 AM   #11
dvw
Secretary of Skate
 
dvw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Hendersonville, TN
Posts: 4,342
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RollerMouse View Post
I measured about 6" between axles.
That's not doing you any favors either. I'd typically put a 6" wheelbase on a men's size 8 boot. You should be or more of a 5-1/4" or 5-1/2" tops.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RollerMouse View Post
I noticed on the Five Stride that they have Skins DA45 plates, are those a good option?
No, the Skins converted to DA45 just doesn't hold up. At best, pivot pins like to jump out of the cups. I had a skater here who made it almost one lap on hers before she snapped them in two right behind the toe stop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RollerMouse View Post
I am looking into trying to get a Magnesium one used. Once I have all the parts do I just take them to a shop and have them assemble it? Nearest one to me is 2hrs away in Houston. I am going to be on a mission to try on as many boots as possible, I cant really afford to not be really sure. I also have seen some old threads about mounting soccer shoes, is that an option? I can easily go try on lots of those.
Soccer boots are an option but not sure how they'll hold up in derby service. As inexpensive as they are, however, it merits investigation especially if they fit they way you need them to.

Send me a PM. Lots of options for you.
__________________
Find some roller derby girls. Don't try to romance them! That don't end well. okie 10/12/2011
Royals FTW! When only the shiny will do... Doc Sk8 05/19/2012
dvw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 2nd, 2014, 06:33 PM   #12
Kennedy
Go fast, turn left
 
Kennedy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Youngstown, Ohio, USA
Posts: 3,767
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RollerMouse View Post
I noticed on the Five Stride that they have Skins DA45 plates, are those a good option? I am looking into trying to get a Magnesium one used.
The Skins are plastic plates. Stay away from Skins. They just arent durable enough for derby. Popping pivots, breakin, king pins ripping out of the plate, etc. Also, some of them had some manufacturing issues that weren't that big of a deal until people started putting the DA45 kits on. Most legitimate shops will sort out the plates with issues, some shops will use whatever parts show up and build them anyway.

IMO, be open to broadening the budget for your skates. Getting good skates that are put together properly make all the difference in the world.
Kennedy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 2nd, 2014, 08:07 PM   #13
llama of death
DIY nutter/Gearhead
 
llama of death's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Washington State (eastern)
Posts: 336
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kennedy View Post
IMO, be open to broadening the budget for your skates. Getting good skates that are put together properly make all the difference in the world.
IMO, not much need for her to buy skates over $400. 200 will get you an ok starter, and 300 will get an intro to intermediate skate. at 400 you are looking at a skate which is beginning to mean business.

If you are concerned, try on many many boots, if you fall in love with a brand new boot buy it, expect to pay 200-400 for the boot alone. If you go package the boot will not necessarily fit perfect, it will be less than optimal but can work out (still think a well chosen Bont would be a good bet, fit to you by an experience Bont fitter ideally or with the tracing method). The best best is as already suggested, take all this experience and find a boot you like on sale in Craigslist or ebay and buy it used. I found mine that way and after some old school alcohol assisted break-in the 27 year old 12narrow Reidell fits like a glove (just finished re-moisturizing/conditioning last night). Cost me $98 and I mounted my Arius to it and it is a dream at $580 including upgraded wheels bearings and stops (though you should have a 'pro' mount yours)
__________________
'A Ferrari won't make you a Grand Prix driver, but a pinto won't even get you to the finish line.' - unknown
llama of death is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 17th, 2014, 02:33 AM   #14
Fancy-Kerrigan
Senior Member
 
Fancy-Kerrigan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Madison, FL
Posts: 758
Default

The plate is the action of your skate. Even if you have a super comfortable boot you will be sore after fighting your crappy plate all night. Do your self a favor and put your money in a plate.
Get a broken in set of leather boots off Ebay or here or any of the FaceBook sale sites. Pop in a new set of innersoles and skate them like you stole them.
A good plate makes a world of difference in the progress of your skating skills.
Fancy-Kerrigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 17th, 2014, 05:34 PM   #15
mmmm_bacon
Senior Poser - Vote 4 Me!
 
mmmm_bacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 101
Default

Bear with me, this will be a long reply, take a moment to read the whole thing though...

I've seen derby girls (and even a co-ed derby guy) skating extremely well and reliably on soccer cleat builds, so it is possible. In fact, I met one girl who had a build without any reinforcement of the sole, just those little metal under-foot bolt connecting plates - and she was an Amazon with a capital "A" do it shouldn't have worked and yet, surprisingly, the sole wasn't flexing badly and even more surprisingly she said there wasn't any significant discomfort! So again, yes, it is very possible to run a soccer cleat built boot in derby. Though I'm not recommending it per se.

I feel really bad for you. You've got two different compounding foot issues and you've already invested in skates that don't work! So... I'd be willing to build you a soccer shoe for free (at cost). You order the shoes, the carbon fiber sheet, epoxy and a packet of jig saw blades and have them shipped to directly to me. I'll measure, cut, press and cure them for you and then you cover the shipping back to your door. You can see the first one I made here: http://www.skatelogforum.com/forums/...ad.php?t=51014 I've already sold a couple of these locally since this one - not even doing any advertising or even trying to make more, just people stopping my daughter in the rink "Where did you get those skates?!?!" "My dad made them." "Can he make me a pair?"

You may want to drop Armadillo a line as well as he does a ton of soccer cleat builds, as do a few others on the forum. Though I don't know if any of them will do pro-bono builds for special cases... never hurts to ask them though.

That said, I would really suggest you -do not- take me up on my offer. I'm trying to help you since you need a very specific type of shoe (which you can indeed find in the soccer shoe market) and are on a very tight budget. However, I think you'd be even better off in the long term by spending a bit more than you want to on a really well fitted, professionally made skate boot. I would suggest two different possibilities:

1) Find a skate shop or a cobbler-shop that will do in-shop heat molding and toe-box stretching. Then get the appropriately sized Jackson Elite boots and have the shop work their magic on them. This will probably take you to the bleeding edge of your budget, if not over. Then you'll have to spend a few bucks more getting your old plate remounted to your new Jackson boot.

2) Get fully custom or at least semi-custom Bonts and then remount your old plates. This will definitely take you beyond your budget, but you will not regret it.

Regardless what you decide to do, do fix the problem and do keep skating!
__________________
"Can't make eggs without bacon, or something like that." - Sidewinder 2014/02/20
Custom wheels by AussieScott: www.coreyskates.com
mmmm_bacon is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:04 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.