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Old December 30th, 2016, 10:23 AM   #1
Entropy
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Question 4x84 or 4x90 better for distance crosstraining?

Hello! I'm a female ultramarathon runner who's switching from Blue Streak Avenger quads to inline skates for outdoor training (adore my Blue Streaks but sick to megadeath of avoiding / hitting / flying over stupid stones), and so need advice please. My situation:
  • Skate sessions will be 20-40kms 1-2/week, mostly solid longbase to complement more specific run workouts.
  • Prefer safety & control over excess speed & ease of speed - am there to workout after all, and cannot afford a crash injury!
  • Currently an intermediate to advanced level quad skater, will spend rink time retraining stops etc. for inlines.
  • Will skate on sealed roads and footpaths, just the usual bumps, cracks, driveways, and stones.
  • Am light-framed, 52kg human if it makes a difference.

I've done a bunch of research and feel either 4x84 or 4x90 setup would be best for me. I really like the sound of Adapt Hyperskate Zeros, and of course they look great for casual use as well as for training, but am also considering Seba models such as GTX84, GT90, Trix 2 90 (hard to tell which is best for me!)

Any thoughts would be appreciated!
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Last edited by Entropy; January 1st, 2017 at 05:39 PM. Reason: Refined question due to further research since first post!
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Old January 1st, 2017, 06:29 PM   #2
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Stupid stones? Well, I have same problem, but the difference is that I'm already on 90x4 inlines. Still fall. Yes, longer wheelbase give stability, but don't expect that switching to inlines will fix the problem entirely.

Sit as low as possible. Don't try to double-push. Use longer setup 90x4 (100x4 will go too) and a full set of protection. Since stones as antipersonnel mines are always ready
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Old January 2nd, 2017, 02:58 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vadim View Post
Stupid stones? Well, I have same problem, but the difference is that I'm already on 90x4 inlines. Still fall. Yes, longer wheelbase give stability, but don't expect that switching to inlines will fix the problem entirely.

Sit as low as possible. Don't try to double-push. Use longer setup 90x4 (100x4 will go too) and a full set of protection. Since stones as antipersonnel mines are always ready
Naw man! I thought they must just pop out of the way of curved inline wheels, rather than act like doorstoppers on the flat faces of quad wheels!

I'll definitely still be wearing protection for my training, but how do so many inline skaters get away without wearing protection if it's still easy to fall? I rarely see pics of inline skaters wearing more than wrist guards.

Anyway I'm pretty sure now that I'll go for Seba Trix 2 90 skates.. should I seriously consider 100s now instead? 4x100 is such a long wheel base that I cannot imagine feeling very nimble in anything other than a straight line.
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Old January 2nd, 2017, 09:23 PM   #4
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Quote:
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Naw man! I thought they must just pop out of the way of curved inline wheels, rather than act like doorstoppers on the flat faces of quad wheels!
Haven't tried quads but inlines must perform (on stones) better. But you'll loose the grip for a moment anyway.
I stumble on stones 10-15 times in a season, this one was lucky one with zero falls, previous one with 2 falls.

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but how do so many inline skaters get away without wearing protection if it's still easy to fall?
Maybe they skate where there are no stones? Dirt, sand and puddles in a park are easier to cope with. Stones is an attribute of motor roads (at least here where I am) and everything that is unlucky to happen too close to them.

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Anyway I'm pretty sure now that I'll go for Seba Trix 2 90 skates.. should I seriously consider 100s now instead? 4x100 is such a long wheel base that I cannot imagine feeling very nimble in anything other than a straight line.
Well, 10.8" 90x4 was enough for me to start having problems with crossovers. They weren't nimble for me at first. And they are still too short for high speed cruising in my opinion. So, if you have to spend some time learning crossovers anyway, it doesn't matter 90x4 or 100x4 you choose (hope I managed to explain the logic). Longer frame give more roll and stability, but are harder to accelerate and turn.

Speaking about your case, I don't really know. If you have long straight runaways, I'd lean towards longer variant from two given.
100s may feel too heavy, but I saw several ladies on 100x4 and 100-90-100-100 attached to slalom boot (RB Maxxum, Sebas etc) and they looked statisfied. Must try on to know for sure how it feels.

Trix have 165 mounting, you can buy them with shorter frames and will have an opportunity to try a longer frame in future. And switch back if it feels bad. Used speed skating frames don't cost much, here in Russia you can get 100x4 with wheels for a price below 100 USD. In "a land down under" things must be cheap too

PS be careful choosing those slalom boots, they are often harsh and have few room in a toe box.
PSS long frames have two main variants of spacing: 165 and 195 mm (some other like 150, 160, 180 are present but rare), and (again rarely) 2nd wheel rub problem.
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Old January 3rd, 2017, 02:37 AM   #5
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Inlines can have problems with a straight crack/sidewalk line if the entire frame drops in it.


I can't recall ever having much of an issue with rocks on quads or inlines unless I was going really slow, with my feet side by side instead of correctly staggered, or possibly had hit a tiny pebble indoors with hard wheels on. Any skateboarder would know what that's like. Instantly getting your wheel chocked by a pebble SUCKS.

Been outdoor skating for a long time, so I'm used to it I suppose.

Inlines are a lot better for sidewalk cracks and the like, that is for sure though.
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Old January 3rd, 2017, 03:39 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Entropy View Post
I thought they must just pop out of the way of curved inline wheels, rather than act like doorstoppers on the flat faces of quad wheels!

I'll definitely still be wearing protection for my training, but how do so many inline skaters get away without wearing protection if it's still easy to fall? I rarely see pics of inline skaters wearing more than wrist guards.

.
Many if not most will "pop" out of the way, at least much better then quads. Trail snakes (root bumps) small sticks and such are still trouble. And as Mort said watch out for cracks in the direction of travel.
Now about those sticks etc. Always keep some knee bend and skate with your weight a bit more on the rear wheels. even more when you see them coming. It will let you roll over them. Think of a boat, if you put all the weight in front it will try to dive down, if you have more weight in back it will try to ride up and over.
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Old January 3rd, 2017, 03:45 AM   #7
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Oh, on the wheel size. Most find the bigger the wheel the better the ride if you can handle the height and length.
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Old January 3rd, 2017, 09:39 AM   #8
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Thanks so much everyone for your responses! This helps a ton. Had a shudder at the thought of losing an entire foot down a footpath crack - I'll mostly be on roads though (I feel too fast and too responsible to go hurtling along footpaths shared by little old ladies), and cannot imagine going onto trails.

The skates I'm leaning towards now are the Seba Trix 2 90 and I can always switch out the frame for a 4x100 with 165mm mount. I know the Trix is a slalom boot but they are sold on a bunch of GT frames as well, plus I think one of the marathon frames, so must be versatile and comfortable for some doing my sort of distances. I do like extra room in the toe box and certainly seek this in the ultra running shoes I wear, but in skating I'm coming over from quads - derby skates specifically - and I guess am used to tight and responsive boots on my hooves.

The other option is the GT range, either GT90 or GT100. Perhaps I haven't quite got my eye in for the aesthetics of inlines yet, but they just don't look so comfortable to me! Unfortunately I live in regional Queensland and there are no skate shops nearby at all, so I must purchase online. Maybe for my first inlines at least I'll choose a boot that's closer to what I know rather than a hard shell type..
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Old January 3rd, 2017, 04:39 PM   #9
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Seba Trix are designed for close control and are therefore very tight fitting - they're not the best if you want to just cruise around for cardio. Additionally, many people I know have found the Trix cuff not to their liking at all... which is a shame considering the $400 they spent on them. Definitely try before you buy.

I would therefore say the GT skate or something similar would be a better option, but imo the GT is overly heavy and not a great skates at all (at least the generation 1 model).

Er, I don't know what else there is. I personally think their FR1 (deluxe) is the best "all-round do-anything" skate that you can just slip on and use, and at $200(?) is a much less risky proposition., but I don't know if that comes in 90mm. I'm sure it probably does these days, or there is no shortage of after-market mods. (I still have my gen1 FR1s from 2007!)

I would definitely go for 90mm (or even 100mm) over 84mm, if only because wheels are easier to procure. Larger sizes sound scary if you are are just starting out, but they soon just become another parameter.
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Old January 3rd, 2017, 08:21 PM   #10
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Seba Trix2 90 are currently marketed as a GT (Gran Touring) style skate, good for long distance cruising. I have not heard anyone say the Trix2 is tight or crushing, like the Seba's true slalom models. I picked up a pair last summer. I mostly like them. The boot is very cushy and comfortable, and gets good forward-backward ankle flexing, while maintaining sideways support. I do wish they were a bit more breathable, though. They get hot and sweaty in the summer time. The one thing I will warn you against is the stock 90mm Seba wheels are junk. They are dirt slow. Skating on them felt like slogging through mud. They would start to slow down drastically as soon as I finished my stride. No glide whatsoever, and it showed in my average times (15% slower than my old 80mm wheels). I'm currently using 80mm Atom Ones with my Seba Trix2 (with an old 80mm frame), but have a set of 90mm Atom Ones to try with the GT frame next season.

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Old January 3rd, 2017, 08:41 PM   #11
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I guess I still have the option to purchase the Adapt Hyperskate Zero boot alone and put the GT90 frame on it with some decent wheels. That nubuck leather would take more looking after though to keep nice, and I am afraid that I'll scuff it up with inevitable falls whilst practicing stops and still new.

Sod it, I have to start somewhere and the Trix still seems best option all-round to get going! I'll wear through those stock wheels practicing and relearning my skills for inlines and purchase better ones once I've improved and have earnt them.
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