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Old January 10th, 2019, 12:36 AM   #21
sk84luv
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I don't think GM or Ford give a rat's ass about Trump, they look at the big picture, and blaming outsourcing on anyone in particular is foolish.(Well, putting the blame on the 1% that controls the actual economy isn't foolish,but whom in particular)

As foolish as imagining that the US can close it's borders, stop world Trade and ignore Global warming....on top of giving a 21% tax cut to industry.

Remember, don't listen to Trump, he lies.
Watch what Trump does, he has his club in Florida staffed by out of country workers, his vineyard workers are all from another country, all the Trump products sold at all Trump locations are made in China.

Anyone without Trump Derangement Syndrome is Deranged

Imaging, actually, cringing at the thought of another 6 years of Trump....destroying all the work the EPA has done for clean water and air, that the consumer protection bureau has done for the consumer, where will health care be, much less the one Trillion a year tacked onto the deficit with his Tax Relief for the 1% of Americans that need it the least, then there's the edgucation of children, in short order....what edgucation?

In the 20' election, if Trump is still involved, after watching the shift of sentiment
In the 18' election (an 8 point shift away from Trump in the rural areas, because of healthcare) The Senate is going to switch, and the cycle will start over, the cycle certainly took a hum dinger of a sudden throb when Obama got elected, well, Trump was way more controversial, a pirate in the White House, some day it will be laughed at, today, it's a crisis, a World Crisis.
Too bad you weren't around when Roosevelt was locking up Japanese American citizens.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 12:39 AM   #22
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You sound like you have a similar opinion as me. I am for whoever I think is going to be best for our country, and I think Trump's doing well at negotiating for us. Trump Derangement Syndrome is alive and well in every Democrat I know.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 02:01 AM   #23
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Anyone without Trump Derangement Syndrome is Deranged
It's interesting how our views can be so divided sometimes. I think it is all about our own perception. What media we watch or read seems to play a role, as well as the opinions of who we are around. Maybe our preconcieved ideas as well. Sometimes I think people stick to a particular view because to change their opinion, at all, would mean admitting their original opinion was incorrect and they can't have that. As a woman, I have always considered it my prerogative to change my mind as much as I like.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 03:20 AM   #24
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The way to make sense of things is to use the "Obama Filter". What is the Obama filter? When you look at many of the things that Obama did, they don't make sense. When you assume that the things Obama did were not meant to help the country, but to hurt it, things make a lot of sense.

For instance, giving $150 BILLION dollars, CASH to Iran. What the FLYING F*CK? Probably our staunchest enemy for several decades. And Obama gives them money. Doesn't make sense until you apply the Obama Filter.

Healthcare has been THE biggest political football being kicked around since before the 2016 election. Obamacare was already failing. People, that is to say, US Citizens were crying out for a fix. Illegal residents are sucking up BILLIONS of US Citizens money to get free healthcare. This is not the issue, just the set up. With this ^^ situation ALREADY IN PLAY, what do the Democrats want to do: Bring in hundreds of thousands more poor sick immigrants to strain the system all the more. This does not make sense. Now apply the Obama Filter. Oh, the Democrats are trying to HURT the country by doing this. NOW it makes sense.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 03:28 AM   #25
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It's interesting how our views can be so divided sometimes. I think it is all about our own perception. What media we watch or read seems to play a role, as well as the opinions of who we are around. Maybe our preconcieved ideas as well. Sometimes I think people stick to a particular view because to change their opinion, at all, would mean admitting their original opinion was incorrect and they can't have that. As a woman, I have always considered it my prerogative to change my mind as much as I like.

Nice

Always thinking for ones self, that is the way of a logical person, a sane person.

I always imagine everyone as a liar, it's up to the reality of things to prove or disprove their point. Usually the latter unfortunately. Even highly educated individuals are poorly skilled at being analytical.

Prime examples of someone's schooling getting in the way of their education.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 01:34 PM   #26
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Too bad you weren't around when Roosevelt was locking up Japanese American citizens.
Are you comparing the racism in 1942 to the Racism Trump is Exibiting today?

Or are you just playing the race card because it's all you have?

Or are you once again defending the Facism you seem to think is the bees-knees?

Or are you once again complaining about antifa, the wonderful group of people defending the US against Facists?

? Honestly, what does the atrocity the US committed against it's own citizens got to do with Trump's trying to be a Dictator?
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Old January 10th, 2019, 01:38 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by ursle View Post
Are you comparing the racism in 1942 to the Racism Trump is Exibiting today?

Or are you just playing the race card because it's all you have?

Or are you once again defending the Facism you seem to think is the bees-knees?

Or are you once again complaining about antifa, the wonderful group of people defending the US against Facists?

? Honestly, what does the atrocity the US committed against it's own citizens got to do with Trump's trying to be a Dictator?
Why are you always such a hypocrite?
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Old January 10th, 2019, 04:47 PM   #28
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Why are you always such a hypocrite?
Your first statement...
Too bad you weren't around when Roosevelt was locking up Japanese American citizens.
Was Bat Chit crazy..

This one can be disected....with ease.

If I were a misogynistic racist who agreed that the US should close it's borders to Brown people and muslims, and wanted to end the EPA and reverse relations with all US trade partners, and let the NRA again with Russias help influence the upcoming elections and try to intentionally split apart the citizens of this country and proclaimed....as I do....that Trump is the worst possible choice for president, then YES, I would be a hypocrite, but I'm not a misogynistic racist.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 06:09 PM   #29
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Why are you always such a hypocrite?
Oh, he is no hypocrite. He is merely trying to redefine reality to suit his liking.

But who would do such a thing? Think on it a minute. It will come to you.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 06:23 PM   #30
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As a woman, I have always considered it my prerogative to change my mind as much as I like.
YOU GO, GIRL!!!

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Prime examples of someone's schooling getting in the way of their education.
great thought here! I recently read the book 'Surely You're Joking Mr Feynman'... a sort of autobiography of Nobel prize winner theoretical physicist, educator, musician, an all around renaisance man who was also real non-conventional smartass. (picked all the locks at Los Alamos during the A-bomb development) He was always advocating making sure students could actually think, not just regurgitate the 'as written text' from a book.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 06:53 PM   #31
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YOU GO, GIRL!!!

great thought here! I recently read the book 'Surely You're Joking Mr Feynman'... a sort of autobiography of Nobel prize winner theoretical physicist, educator, musician, an all around renaisance man who was also real non-conventional smartass. (picked all the locks at Los Alamos during the A-bomb development) He was always advocating making sure students could actually think, not just regurgitate the 'as written text' from a book.
You go girl?
Great thought here EXCLAMATION POINT.

You are so obvious and disingenuous when you pander.
Careful. After bj cozies up to you, he'll be expecting you to agree with him on stuff, or he will become very upset.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 02:30 AM   #32
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YOU GO, GIRL!!!
Thanks! I guess what I'm trying to say, and what I believe bjvircks and Mort understood, is it is good to try to stay as open minded as possible. I think the world is more shades of grey than black and white. It seems pretty much pointless to discuss a topic with a mind that refuses to change, despite evidence to the contrary of their viewpoint.

Rufus, if you were talking to me, you should know me better than that by now. I swear to God you are stirring the pot for all you are worth. Have fun.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 03:57 AM   #33
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... I always imagine everyone as a liar, it's up to the reality of things to prove or disprove their point. Usually the latter unfortunately...
I come from a professional background in which there was an underlying need to trust that the people I was working with were competent, rational and truthful until they proved otherwise. People who were not rational or truthful were not allowed to stay around. People who were not competent got demoted and demoted until they were at a level they WERE competent at... or they left on their own.

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... It seems pretty much pointless to discuss a topic with a mind that refuses to change, despite evidence to the contrary of their viewpoint...
My whole life has been about "effective discussion". Effective and healthy discussion is pretty easy with emotionally healthy & rational people. Otherwise? not so much.

Dec8r... you are correct in your asssesment that my comment was really about the bulk of your post, remaining open-minded.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 04:43 AM   #34
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Rufus, if you were talking to me, you should know me better than that by now. I swear to God you are stirring the pot for all you are worth. Have fun.
Nothing aimed at you. I got a good read on bj. He is by and large an elitist prick. So when he tries to be "familiar" and up beat, it is just not natural. It is like seeing Richard Nixon, or Don Cheny, walking funky up to a group of blacks saying what's up my brothers. It doesn't pass the smell test.

Bj engages in all of this for a purpose. To persuade. He thinks I am like him. The notion of shooting the sh*t, discussing all of this stuff just for the heck of it, is completely foreign to him. So because HE thinks I have an agenda, one he does not like, HE must try and counter it. His usual demeanor is condescending, but in the post I was ridiculing, it was not. I'm just F ing with him. You know I know how to do that.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 04:53 AM   #35
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I engage in attempts to make a difference. Rufus apparently is just here to jerk around and be a jackass. No growth. No community good or benefit. Just "stir the pot". So be it.

It takes all kinds.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 02:09 PM   #36
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I engage in attempts to make a difference. Rufus apparently is just here to jerk around and be a jackass. No growth. No community good or benefit. Just "stir the pot". So be it.

It takes all kinds.
You're not here to make a difference, you have a death grip on turning others to your opinion. Not here to be a jerk. You haven't SEEN me be a jerk. To assume that I am so WONDERFUL I must benefit others is arrogance. I like putting my opinion out there and see if anyone has an interesting opinion, agreeing or differing. Good recent example is me and Dec8r kicking around our opinions on AOC. This is coffee shop chit chat. I have said this for years. Some folks just don't get it.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 03:40 PM   #37
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Golly, whom would I rather read a post from, someone ignorant of facts or someone that only post's facts and corrects the post's if inaccuracies are discovered.

Let me make that simple...would I rather read a post from someone who only post's to piss off other form members (a troll, by definition) or someone that post's facts for intelligent discussion.

Obviously....never argue with an idiot, they will bring you down to their level and beat you with experence.

Yes, trolls are welcome on the forum, but what satisfaction does one get from being a troll, simply trying to disrupt and argue, yes, this particular troll doesn't know reality, doesn't know right from wrong, more is the pity.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 05:59 PM   #38
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... I got a good read on bj...
only sort of.

A while ago some friends, my wife & I took a weekend trip to catch a performance of of "HAMILTON". One interesting set of lines was between Hamilton and Aaron Burr. Hamilton's point was 'A person has to stand for something or he stands for NOTHING.'

Mindless argument just for the sake of being argumentative is a waste of EVERYONE'S oxygen.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 06:28 PM   #39
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only sort of.

A while ago some friends, my wife & I took a weekend trip to catch a performance of of "HAMILTON". One interesting set of lines was between Hamilton and Aaron Burr. Hamilton's point was 'A person has to stand for something or he stands for NOTHING.'

Mindless argument just for the sake of being argumentative is a waste of EVERYONE'S oxygen.
Not sort of, completely. Looking at art or listening to music is a waste of time. But not to the person doing it. It is self edification. I LIKE hearing other points of view. Well, at least when they are not totally stupid. Despite your intelligence on one hand, you are mindless on another. You are programmed to compete and win the day, even when no competition is in play. You are like the circuit boards you used to design: Meant for one purpose, but nothing else. I am a philosopher. My intelligence is much more wide ranging than yours. You are just a fly under my microscope. I got you. You are one dimensional. Mind you, that is not a criticism or a snipe. It is just a fact. Neither do I hold it against you. It is just who you are.

And as far as wasting oxygen, no one is holding a gun to your head forcing you to either read this stuff, or reply to it. Me, on the other hand, if I see something interesting, I'll post about it. I'll get replies or not. It is kind of like fishing for fun. Not too worried about getting a bite. But if I get a good bite, all the better.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 09:18 PM   #40
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Not sort of, completely. Looking at art or listening to music is a waste of time. But not to the person doing it. It is self edification. I LIKE hearing other points of view. Well, at least when they are not totally stupid. Despite your intelligence on one hand, you are mindless on another. You are programmed to compete and win the day, even when no competition is in play. You are like the circuit boards you used to design: Meant for one purpose, but nothing else. I am a philosopher. My intelligence is much more wide ranging than yours. You are just a fly under my microscope. I got you. You are one dimensional. Mind you, that is not a criticism or a snipe. It is just a fact. Neither do I hold it against you. It is just who you are.

And as far as wasting oxygen, no one is holding a gun to your head forcing you to either read this stuff, or reply to it. Me, on the other hand, if I see something interesting, I'll post about it. I'll get replies or not. It is kind of like fishing for fun. Not too worried about getting a bite. But if I get a good bite, all the better.
It's not Cognitive Dissonance, rufus only takes one view on matters, and it's always the non factual view.
It's always been Dunning-Kreuger

The Dunning-Kruger effect is a type of cognitive bias in which people believe that they are smarter and more capable than they really are. Essentially, low ability people do not possess the skills needed to recognize their own incompetence. The combination of poor self-awareness and low cognitive ability leads them to overestimate their own capabilities.


The term lends a scientific name and explanation to a problem that many people immediately recognize—that fools are blind to their own foolishness. As Charles Darwin wrote in his book The Descent of Man, "Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge
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