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Roller Derby Forum Discussions about banked-track and flat-track roller derby events, teams, skaters, and training methods.

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Old May 24th, 2011, 03:45 PM   #21
Engel
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Originally Posted by Nick V View Post
I always say to the girls: I do not want to see the team captain (Kamikaze Pizza Kat) in the position of having to mark a member absent, only to hear excuses at the next team event, like: "I'm sorry, I couldn't, because..."
Unless there was a car accident, or robbery, or a death in the family, or some such, there is no such thing as 'couldn't'. That magic word is almost always shorthand for "I prioritized something else".
there is, there is life. work, sickness in the family, it doesnt need to be death. own sickness. if someone is sick and goes to practice, can only get sickier during the week because she forced her limits.
there are many ways why couldnt exists. and yes, if she prioritized something else, like her own health or family, thats the wise thing to do. derby doesnt pay your bills, it only makes more bills to be paied.
so if it isnt for a silly excuse like from that girl having a hangover and seeing air shows, there IS such a thing as couldnt.
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Old May 24th, 2011, 08:05 PM   #22
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On our league, if someone misses 4 weeks in a row, they have to go back to bootcamp again.
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Old May 24th, 2011, 09:20 PM   #23
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Also, Sisters Grim RollerGrrls have nothing to do with C-Maxs portrayal of roller derby and dont subscribe to ridiculous rules like 'you must wear fishnets' or tell people that roller derby is 'a bunch of hot girls on roller skates hitting each other' :P
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We are unfortunately affiliated. I got involved with C-Max as an event coordinator and the sport grabbed me so much that I ended up creating my own team. From there it was a lot of blood sweat and tears with absolutely no help or direction from the league.

Sisters Grim have their own training routine, rules and regulations (in terms of attendance etc.), practice venues and general infrastructure. The only time we are with the league is on Sundays at league practice where our team coach coaches the more advanced skaters and I take the beginners.

With most of the skaters in the surrounding areas already in C - Max affiliated teams its difficult to revolt against them. Instead we are slowly trying to convert skaters, though this doesn't seem to be working too well.

Has anything like this ever happened to one of you? what did you do about it?
Please take this advice in the friendly spirit that it is intended, but publicly criticizing another team/league is really not going to reflect well on yourselves. We've all come across/played other leagues/individual skaters that have rubbed us up the wrong way. Maybe they are sore losers, ungracious hosts, arrogant winners or dirty players (or a combination of all 4!). Doesn't matter. Talking negatively about them in public is always going to make you look petty (feel free to bitch about them to your hearts content in private though). If you have an official grievance with them over an issue then it's best to bring it up in an official capacity.
With regards to how unhappy you are with the affiliation with C-Max I have to say that the way you all seem to be modeling your league structure is pretty unique. It seems to me like you have one 'head-league' and your own separate regional team with your own training venue and coach? There's no rule that says you have to be affiliated with C-Max at all if that's not what you want.
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Old May 24th, 2011, 09:25 PM   #24
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If players can't make minimum attendance then maybe put them on NSO duty until it improves.
I'm sure this comes from a well-intentioned position of needing all the help you can get to run a league/bout/whatever, and not wanting to cast a volunteer aside - but if you treat "NSO duty" as a punishment then you will not have a culture that values NSOs and other officials, and subsequent trouble attracting and retaining a solid officiating crew.
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Old May 24th, 2011, 09:40 PM   #25
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There's no rule that says you have to be affiliated with C-Max at all if that's not what you want.
yes, you can always take your team and start your own league. more work? yes. but if you will feel more confortable with it, so be it. my league only las enough people for one team and a half. but im sure that if half of us wouldnt be happy with the way the league is presented or whatever else, we could get together and start our own league. many leagues just have one team for a really long time.
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Old May 24th, 2011, 09:44 PM   #26
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GBR - You're not Great Barrier Ref by any chance?
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Old May 24th, 2011, 09:48 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by GBR View Post
I'm sure this comes from a well-intentioned position of needing all the help you can get to run a league/bout/whatever, and not wanting to cast a volunteer aside - but if you treat "NSO duty" as a punishment then you will not have a culture that values NSOs and other officials, and subsequent trouble attracting and retaining a solid officiating crew.
beat me to it, my boyfriend is an NSO for our league, and often complains that on bout day he is only given newbies to work with as people don't want to be an NSO on a permanant basis because they are not treated as well as they could be
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Old May 24th, 2011, 11:07 PM   #28
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I know for our league, you have to attend two out of three practices per week to make attendance requirements. If for some reason you can't make that requirement, the captain or whoever it is you notify, needs to be told BEFOREHAND, with a reason, as to why you aren't there. If you don't make attendance requirements you cannot go up a skill level, or bout or play on a team etc.
Our league DOES have a social skater membership, where you come to Sunday training only, and there's no attendance requirements, but I don't think you actually go up levels from that. But it is good for people who want to train, but can't make the training commitments. I'm in that situation, our other training days are Tuesday and Thursday evenings (I think Thursdays), and I have three kids and a husband that works so it makes it difficult. But the "social skater" option allows you to get some training in without letting the rest of the league down by not showing up.
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Old May 25th, 2011, 11:40 AM   #29
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publicly criticizing another team/league is really not going to reflect well on yourselves. If you have an official grievance with them over an issue then it's best to bring it up in an official capacity.
Thanks for that post, it really did make me think. I have since approached the League chair about my feelings on the website and the way they portray roller derby in general. She took everything i said to heart and has since appointed me as the websites admin. From there the entire website will be remodeled with everyone's feelings in mind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Salamanda View Post
the way you all seem to be modeling your league structure is pretty unique. It seems to me like you have one 'head-league' and your own separate regional team with your own training venue and coach?
This is true, we have four teams in SA and all are affiliated with C-Max. I personally want to remodel this though as it's near impossible to have league practices and meetings with girls half way across the country. I think C-Max and the girls involved can be looked towards for guidance now that things have been dont through trial and error, but there should be other leagues set up.
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Old May 26th, 2011, 02:54 AM   #30
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AFAIK, Tucson Roller Derby was originally set up to be a single team based in Tucson that would play within Arizona Roller Derby (based in Phoenix). That lasted perhaps a month or two? They split on friendly terms, it was probably difficult to make it to league practices and meetings that were an hour or two's drive away.

Likewise, there's a plethora of leagues in upstate NY which had friendly geographic splits over the last few years. If the split happens due to geography, generally things are a good bit more friendly.

The only really successful multi-city league would be the Bay Area Derby Girls. Thing to know: While they bout in different cities and have home teams named for cities in the area, they all practice at the same place in Oakland. Without actually knowing I would guaranty that the skaters on those teams aren't necessarily from the city their team is named for.

Gotham Girls certainly don't assign skaters to teams depending on which borough the skater is from, even though their teams are named for them (Bronx Gridlock, Brooklyn Bombshells, Manhattan Mayhem, and Queens of Pain). And would their skaters from Staten Island have to form their own team? The Staten Island Fairies, perhaps?

Duke City Derby has added at least one team (from Taos) that I suspect they'll spin off as an independent league if the numbers there merit it.

There is I think ONE league in British Columbia (western Canadian province) with a large number of geographically-separated teams from different towns in the region. They only came together as one league recently, I'd give 'em a while to see if it actually remains functionally.
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Old May 26th, 2011, 05:18 AM   #31
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Western Australia Roller Derby (www.warollerderby.com.au) were originally set up with geographically distinct teams, some from Perth metro area and some from more regional/remote areas of WA, under one league banner. It was still like that when I left Oz but I just looked over their website and it seems they've abandoned that model.
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Old May 26th, 2011, 05:36 AM   #32
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Here's why that model tends to fail, while working fine in other sports organizations:

Roller derby leagues are generally DIY businesses. Where everybody and nobody owns each component and the whole thing. Your major league sports organizations tend to have individual owners (or companies) owning the team, while a collective of owners (or even a non-profit like the NHL) owns and runs the league they're part of.

For roller derby, each league is generally (or hopefully) run more as a collective or non-profit. Even if there's one or two skaters who are the nominal owners. They don't dictate what happens and what doesn't.

Trying to run an organization like that tends to break down when there's large distances between different units. It gets to feel like it's us over here and them over there.

Realistically, any league that has more than four league teams (meaning home teams, not travel teams) is generally due for a league split. You can count on one hand the number of leagues out there with five or more teams on one hand.

I know TXRD Lonestar Rollergirls have five home teams, possibly South Side as well. Keep in mind that both these leagues are banked track leagues with a decided intraleague focus. If a home team or two wanted to split off, they'd not only need to find a new practice space for themselves, they'd have to buy or build a track to boot!

Toronto Roller Derby used to have five or more home teams, I believe they shelved at least one of them recently. I know of a number of WFTDA leagues no longer play intraleague derby at all. And I know one that existed for three seasons before it had more than a single team.
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