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Artistic Skating Forum Discussions about any topic related to artistic roller skating including quad artistic skating, inline figure skating, pairs, dance, synchronized skating, and show skating.

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Old July 19th, 2016, 11:36 AM   #21
Ancient1
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Larry,

How is your salchow? The salchow is 2/3 rotation of the Axel. Another way to think of it is that the Axel is a way to start a salchow starting from the forward direction for the first half rotation and then holding it for the remainder of the salchow.

Try practicing the salchow. Work on it with your free leg close in and not a wild swing as some do when they learn it. At first it feels more comfortable to do a salchow with swinging the leg around, but if you have some discipline and trust your skills of keeping square and bringing the leg in close instead of swinging then the axel will be much easier.
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Old July 19th, 2016, 11:52 AM   #22
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And I have seen a few people on this forum post their axels and it's always great to see the jump actually being performed by someone, but.....


I'm getting closer to trying to perform the Axel. Last week I tried a few and they were very, very bad. They were really sad looking. I didn't have the guts to throw the Axel and I kind of wimped into the jump very, very slow and tried to spin/rotate it very fast just a few inches off the ground with my skates on at the rink. Well, I got the rotation but was bent all over and landing on my left foot and reaching for the ground. It was really sad.

So, I have been practicing the jump off skates with not much luck. Then I got this revelation, to get very good balance over the left skate and jump straight up and wow, I almost got one off, off skates.

This reminds me of when I do a loop jump on skates. I have been practicing them quite regularly on skates. And I have noticed you don't have to skate fast, but you do need to be on perfect balance on the ROB before you throw the loop jump. The more you feel perfectly over you ROB when doing the loop jump the easier it is.

Same thing for the axel off skates. If I can just place the weight perfectly on top of the ROF when I jump the axel it will spin/rotate very easily and I'm almost there. I can almost do this jump off skates, easily. It's all about balance and being perfectly over the top of the ROF and jumping straight up.

More to come. And happy jumping.

Larry O
I try it once in a while off skates, no ankle weights. It's off my radar on skate. There are soooooo many things I need to learn before an axel. I'm not really thinking of ever going over 1 rotation on skate. But I get 1 1/4 off skate. If I land that on purpose it's better than trying to force the 1 1/2. Of course that would be deadly on skates.
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Old September 2nd, 2016, 11:45 AM   #23
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Default I figured out how to this off skate

Still not on my on-skate radar, I have sooooo much to learn before killing myself. But I made this discovery. Whe I first tried the mapes I posted around the wrong foot the picking one, bad idea. Then it hit me you end up posting around the landing foot no matter what. Otherwise you will come down on a foot that is not under your weight and that always sucks, trust me I know. But in a waltz you start posting around the jumping foot. But at the last second you bring the new free hip around the landing foot. Its so brief on this tiny jump, but it's there, you switch the posts in air, or you wouldn't present ROB.

So off skate I tried it on an axel. It works, I get the full 1.5 which I had never done before. It's nothing like, I have the full feel for the jump and can imagine it on skates though. But I make the whole jump and land upright. I'll get some off skate video this weekend.

Anyway, is this incorrect thinking for this jump?
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Old September 2nd, 2016, 04:59 PM   #24
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For jumping and spinning, mastering a solid edge should come first. Without mastery of the edge, you are prone to make technical errors that will need to be corrected before you can succeed in performing a clean jump or spin.


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Many years ago, when I was skating 1970 or so, the RSROA was big into the Jerry Lewis Telethon/Skate-a-thon/Muscular Dystrophy. It was common to skate for 24 hours.
I remember that. I did the entire event at Holiday Skating Center.
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Old September 3rd, 2016, 01:00 AM   #25
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For jumping and spinning, mastering a solid edge should come first. Without mastery of the edge, you are prone to make technical errors that will need to be corrected before you can succeed in performing a clean jump or spin
So.. what diameter of a circle should one edge before it is considered solid?
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Old September 3rd, 2016, 07:24 PM   #26
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So.. what diameter of a circle should one edge before it is considered solid?
If you want to skate freestyle then you want the arc of your circle to fill the entire rink. You need to maintain the edge in the entire execution and not wiggle into it.
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Old September 4th, 2016, 08:09 AM   #27
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Default how long is a string

Derrick,
It isn't the depth of the edge that matters, as long as it isn't too exaggerated. Holding an edge means to keep it in the same arc and not wobble the arc. That's where figures helps learn control.

Specifically on most jumps you don't want a very deep arc for your edge in normal execution. Too many beginners want a very deep edge which throws the jump off.

I like what Gee said about the arc filling the entire rink, but I will add, may be even less of an arc for a jump.

For Jumps keep the arc wide. On the spins the arc will get tighter as you enter the spin and if you were looking down it would seem to spiral in toward where the spin is centered. In footwork, it varies on what you are doing.

So again I ask you: How long is a piece of string?



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So.. what diameter of a circle should one edge before it is considered solid?
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Old September 4th, 2016, 02:30 PM   #28
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Derrick,
It isn't the depth of the edge that matters, as long as it isn't too exaggerated. Holding an edge means to keep it in the same arc and not wobble the arc. That's where figures helps learn control
OK just trying to determine where I sit. I can hold the eight edges smoothly (I don't wobble, that I am aware of) on any of the circles including the session skating circle. I'm not really trying to figures. It's free foot postion that I don't know where it should be.

I can spiral down til the skate goes swoosh and I'm forced to change edge or three turn ( that is change edge or change edge).

I'm sure theres a million things I don't know that I should be practicing though. I'll try to get more video to make sure we are talking about the same things.
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Old September 4th, 2016, 03:37 PM   #29
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Derrick,
For jumps keep a slight edge, just a little more than no edge at all (a HUGE arc). For spins make it tight.

As for your free leg. It goes where you want it to go. Just make it look nice and make it compliment your jump, spin or footwork. Hint on Free Leg: Keep the toe pointed down and slightly to the outside... I SAID SLIGHTLY! It's best to keep the knee straight 95% of the time. when bending the knee it is for the jump or spin when implementing the action, or in some footwork, otherwise keep the free leg straight with the toe pointed and I mean pointed hard. NO TOES in the air. You will have time to put your toes in the air when you're dead. For skating you want them pointed down.




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OK just trying to determine where I sit. I can hold the eight edges smoothly (I don't wobble, that I am aware of) on any of the circles including the session skating circle. I'm not really trying to figures. It's free foot postion that I don't know where it should be.

I can spiral down til the skate goes swoosh and I'm forced to change edge or three turn ( that is change edge or change edge).

I'm sure theres a million things I don't know that I should be practicing though. I'll try to get more video to make sure we are talking about the same things.
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Old September 7th, 2016, 09:56 AM   #30
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Smile Derrick's post in another section of the forum got me thinking about the axel?

Here's Derrick's Post.

Quote:
So....... I did some axel practice in my big yard. The neighbors were watching hee hee. But I did it, I got a full axel with a nice-ish landing. The extra space really helped. I'm forgiving my neighbors for calling my family weirdos. It's their comments that convinced me to jump in the most highly visible flat spot in the neighborhood. I'm going over there right now, thanking them, and giving them all a kiss right on the lips.


The next step is to transfer that off "ice" jump to the roller skating floor. That is not easy to do but three steps come to mind.

1) When jumping with skates on try to pick a spot on the wall that has a line that goes up and down. In bowling we call that "spot" bowling. You don't actually aim for the pins you aim for a "spot" in the bowling alley. If you hit that imaginary "spot" you will knock down the pins down in the lane..lol!.

a) The worst thing you can do when throwing the axel is to throw it off axis..ie...tilted. So, you align you body to an imaginary line going up and down on the far wall and jump to it.

Note: Why is it bad to jump off axis/tilted. When you fall you can hit your head and that is the worst injury in skating. Ask Dale Earnhardt Jr. He will sit out six months of racing because of concussions sustain through racing accidents...ie... hitting his head.

2) Jump with an "arch" in your back. Arching your back puts your body over the ROB landing edge. If you think about it when you do a waltz jump you arch your back on the landing. When you skate dance you arch your back to put your weight over your skates and when you perform a OF Traveling camel you arch your back to get over the LOF edge traveling down the skating floor. So arch your back a lot. It's key to landing this jump.

3) Lastly jump square to the wall and over you ROB skate. If you do this correctly the jump will come easily. It's all about good form (arch in back), jumping straight (axis perpendicular) and square (not twisting at take off).

Good Luck!

And Happy Jumping,

Larry Otani

Last edited by larryoracing; September 7th, 2016 at 11:55 AM.
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Old January 5th, 2017, 07:44 AM   #31
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Smile An axel done slowly/rotating slowly and landing like a waltz jump!

Well, I won’t be skating this month for financial reasons, but it’s giving me some time to strengthen my legs. I have been doing full squats and I think my knees and legs are getting stronger.

I was watching Andreas’ Video and others from the 30’s and 40’s and 50’s and I started to notice something. My pro told me to make my jumps real easy, I think so I wouldn’t hurt myself jumping wildly into the sky and possibly hurting myself…falling

Then I started looking at skaters jumping the axels from the 1940’s and 1950’s and I started noticing that the jumpers were jumping fairly high, but rotating the axel very slowly making the jump seem very simple and easy.

It got me thinking. Jump easy rotate the first revolution and be ready for the landing like your ready for the landing on the waltz jump. Off skates my axel seems to come very easy even if its not fully rotated but landing on the right foot. I think I’m getting somewhere

Thanks for listening.

Larry
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Old January 5th, 2017, 11:22 AM   #32
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Well, I won’t be skating this month for financial reasons, but it’s giving me some time to strengthen my legs. I have been doing full squats and I think my knees and legs are getting stronger.

I was watching Andreas’ Video and others from the 30’s and 40’s and 50’s and I started to notice something. My pro told me to make my jumps real easy, I think so I wouldn’t hurt myself jumping wildly into the sky and possibly hurting myself…falling

Then I started looking at skaters jumping the axels from the 1940’s and 1950’s and I started noticing that the jumpers were jumping fairly high, but rotating the axel very slowly making the jump seem very simple and easy.

It got me thinking. Jump easy rotate the first revolution and be ready for the landing like your ready for the landing on the waltz jump. Off skates my axel seems to come very easy even if its not fully rotated but landing on the right foot. I think I’m getting somewhere

Thanks for listening.

Larry
good point, u should always jump up and in the circle, for a single i guess slow rotation is ok, wont work well for doubles and triples though. good luck
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