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Speed Skating Forum Most of the discussions in this forum will be about inline speed skating but discussions about ice speed skating and quad roller speed skating are also welcome.

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Old November 28th, 2006, 03:56 PM   #1
MNGreene
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Default Setups with different wheel sizes/spacing

I read a lot about skates set up with different wheel sizes, such as 3x110 and 1X100. Can someone explain what is trying to be accomplished by having one wheel smaller or any other setup where the wheels are not all the same?


I also wonder about setups where there is an abnormal gap between wheels. For instance, one good skater at NSIM had 3 or 4 wheels with normal spacing and then one wheel well out in front of the others. I am guessing he was trying to get more wheel length without adding wheel weight - is that correct? If not, what does a setup like this accomplish?
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Old November 28th, 2006, 04:41 PM   #2
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Simple

The larger the wheel, the faster you can go. However the higher off the ground you get, there become more issues, like stress on the ankles and other technical reasons. It is also preferred for the boot to tilt forward a little. A good compromise is to use a little smaller wheel in the #2 position, which is the lowest point of your foot, and than you can fit in larger wheels in the back where you really are doing most the pushing. The front wheel can be big because it is farther forward from your toes enough to kind of clear your boot and be sticking up. A lot of boots that have similar size 4 wheels, has to cut out of the boot an area over the #2 wheel so the boot can be lower to the ground.

Hope that clears it up.
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Old November 28th, 2006, 04:55 PM   #3
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Ideally you'd want all the wheels evenly spaced. Ideally you want your foot to be as low to the ground as possible. And originally boots came with a 6.5"(165mm). This was well and good during the 5x84 and smaller days. When 4x100s started cropping up the worry over "deck height". To lower the deck height manufacturers moved the #1 wheel forward to clear the bolt under the ball of the foot. This lead to gap-ois. Some manufacturers have a bigger gap than others.

The other alternative that came up was to change the wheel that is under the ball of the foot to a smaller wheel to clear that bolt. and have a lower deck height.

Hope this helps.
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Old November 28th, 2006, 08:43 PM   #4
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I agree with the above posts.

Even or mostly even wheel spacing is better then the huge gaps since wheels work best when they share the load with the wheel next to them. A wheel will not roll as quickly if the load on it is too high. Frames that have big gaps will create higher loading on the wheel that is alone out away from the others plus the frame will load up more if it is longer so in general the best to use 3x100 if your boot is 165mm spacing and 4x100 if your boot is 195mm spacing. The foot height for these two systems is about the same and the overall length is similar. The big downside is that the 3x100 means you have to buy two wheel sizes and will not have the ability to rotate the second wheel so many people tend to use the big gap 165mm frames or 3x100 only until they upgrade to the newer 195mm boot designs.

With 110mm wheels we are really getting near the point where the skater is too high off the ground. If you have VERY good form and are comfortable with a high frame plus are usually skating at high speeds the 4x110 setup is an option but for most people I think a 4x100 is better since it is easier to control and really I don't think the 110mm is going to make most people faster. I actually think some people will be slower on 110mm because it is harder to use the extra roll if your ankles turn to jello due to the extra height.

The 3x110+100 hybrid designs give an option that allows people to have the big wheels in back where they count without the extra height but once again the downside comes with wheel rotation and wheel wear. The 100mm wheel is stuck in postion #2. Just like 3x100+90 wheel #2 can't be rotated so in my experiance the result is less poor wheel wear leading to the wheels #1,#3,#4 wearing faster then wheel #2 performance overall and then the set becomming out of sync with no rotation option.

My feeling is that for most people the best setup is 4x100 on a 195mm boot. If you have a 165mm boot and a 5x84 frame, I recommend people get a new boot and new frame since almost everyone I have seen who tried 165mm boots with 4x100 or 3x100 later on upgraded to the 4x100/195mm combo. With the 195mm boot you can also try out the 4x110 idea but remember that unless you have perfect form it is likely that the bigger wheels will make you slower since the extra height and length makes it harder to generate power with such a large setup.

165mm bolt spacing was designed for 5x80 or 5x84. The newer 195mm bolt option on boots was designed for 4x100. Using 100mm on older style 165mm boots will never be perfect so the gaps and 3x100 hybrids are simply options that try to minimize the problems.
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Last edited by gatorback; November 29th, 2006 at 12:36 AM.
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 01:37 AM   #5
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I can only respond regarding the TruRev 4x100 for 165 spacing. This is probably the frame with the gap you were referring to. The reason for the gap is the the bottom of the foot closer to the ground. You can ask anyone who's ever skated on this frame, the gap has absolutely zero negative effect. I think it performs as well if not better than a shorter 4x100 for 195 spacing due to the back three wheels being so close together. Some will try to have you believe that this setup is not efficient so that you'll go out and buy a new set of boots, but if you have boots with 6.5 spacing this is one of the best frames available. That being said, 3 x110 + 1 x 100 is even better.
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 01:53 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Major View Post
Some will try to have you believe that this setup (4x100 w/ 165 bolt spacing) is not efficient so that you'll go out and buy a new set of boots, but if you have boots with 6.5 spacing this is one of the best frames available. That being said, 3 x110 + 1 x 100 is even better.
...so good out and buy a new set of boots? LOL.
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 04:56 AM   #7
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Quote:
...so good out and buy a new set of boots? LOL.
yes if you want to move up to 110's, but if you want to skate 100's you don't have to.
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 09:18 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Major View Post
yes if you want to move up to 110's, but if you want to skate 100's you don't have to.
have you noticed that you almost never see a used longmount boot for sale? I think they are a little more in demand.
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 02:49 PM   #9
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The only problem facing the TruRev 6.5 frame is that there are so many other bad 6.5 4x100 frames on the market.
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 05:24 PM   #10
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Agreed from what i hear, as i've never actually tried a 6.5 frame 100mm, but i keep tabs on a skate partner on the 6.5 4x100 liked it a lot. Or atleast he did, in that he's sidelined with a broken tibula from a fall. But he's not blaming the frame. Or maybe he is. (I haven't talked to him).... Well, maybe I'll offer to take that thing off his hands for a couple of bucks....

But anyway, most of the posters on the other websites have universally had only good things to say about that frame.
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Old December 4th, 2006, 03:25 AM   #11
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I understand what you are saying about the gap setup.

See the 2 skaters out front to see if this is what you were thinking of:

http://www.asiorders.com/view_user_p...32&ID=26813813

http://www.asiorders.com/view_user_p...32&ID=26813812
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Old December 4th, 2006, 09:46 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MNGreene View Post
I understand what you are saying about the gap setup.

See the 2 skaters out front to see if this is what you were thinking of:

http://www.asiorders.com/view_user_p...32&ID=26813813

http://www.asiorders.com/view_user_p...32&ID=26813812

This was one of my skates. That's what is being talked about.


I would still be using the frames if it were not for 110s.
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