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Old December 6th, 2008, 11:40 PM   #21
Doc Sk8
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Thumbs up Good idea.

Yeah Rick is the Art Guru.... He has experience fixing all sorts of things his son broke while competing..
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Old December 7th, 2008, 12:01 AM   #22
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Rick has chimed in on my past threads.

I wonder if maybe I am tightening the action nut too much? I don't use those little shorty tools that come with most skates. I use auto mechanic tools. That is one of the things that drew me to the snyder SD plate -- the action nut is not that thin type that requires those flimsy elephant wrenches.

So I am using a full sized wrench with a lot more leverage. I simply tighten it to teh point that the king pin can't be turned. I'm not cranking it as tight as possible.

Thoughts?

Well, my boot is about worn out as well, so what is probably going to happen is this plate and boot will become my spare set, and it is probably time to bit the bullet and break in a new boot and use a different plate. I will reach out and see what Rick recommends for a plate for free skating.
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Old December 7th, 2008, 02:29 AM   #23
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Exclamation Too much of a good thing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TCarlisle View Post
I wonder if maybe I am tightening the action nut too much? I don't use those little shorty tools that come with most skates. I use auto mechanic tools. That is one of the things that drew me to the snyder SD plate -- the action nut is not that thin type that requires those flimsy elephant wrenches.
I suppose it's possible that you're just cranking everything down so hard that it's under stress constantly. If you have the split type collar on the hanger, you could be causing it to crack prematurely which weakens the whole structure. That would certainly cost you kingpins.

You should probably take your skates down and inspect the hangers. If everything looks ok, put 'em back together and just snug it down this time. It really doesn't take much.
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Old December 9th, 2008, 01:02 AM   #24
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OK, I give up! I started working on replacing the hanger tonight, and for some reason I took apart the wrong skate -- the one that wasn't broke. And what did I find? Another shattered hanger.

So I proceeded with attempting to change the hanger on the one skate, and quite frankly it is just going to be too involved. Those rivets are very hard -- harder than my drill bits. Sure I can go get better drill bits, but quite frankly even if I take the time to replace this hanger, then order another and do it again, I still have no confidence in these plates at all.

So it is probably best if I suck it up and get a different plate. So here are my questions:

1) My snyder SD plate has a 10 stamped on it, which I presume is the size. If I get a size 10 synder advantage, will the mounting holes line up with the SD so I don't have to redrill holes in the boots?

2) Is there an equivalent plate size in a roll-line that would have the same wheelbase, mounting pattern, hole alignment as the snyder SD?

3) What is a good choice in the roll-line models that is good for free skating, at least as good as the SD's I am abandoning?

Thanks!
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Old December 9th, 2008, 01:13 AM   #25
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The Variant is as good...(if you put urethane cushions on it) but good luck getting ANY other plate with the same exact mounting hole alignment. I just don't see that happening.

You could still just pay the $30 plus shipping to have Snyder fix them though.
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Old December 9th, 2008, 02:06 AM   #26
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If you are happy with the wheelbase of your current plate then just choose which plate you want to replace it with in a similar wheelbase. Personally I think all the plates with riveted on hangers look sus and would never bother with any of them.

Dont worry about the mounting holes the new plate will cover most of them up. My boots are on thier second plates and a new set is going on before christmas so I will have holes everywhere.
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Old December 9th, 2008, 02:42 AM   #27
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Default Snyder 10

6 3/4" wheel base.... 6.75*25.4 = 171.45mm so a 170 Roll Line would be fine. NONE of the holes mentioned are even close.

Get the Mistral and get 'em re-mounted.....
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Old December 9th, 2008, 03:27 AM   #28
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6 3/4" wheel base.... 6.75*25.4 = 171.45mm so a 170 Roll Line would be fine. NONE of the holes mentioned are even close.

Get the Mistral and get 'em re-mounted.....
Sounds good. I thiknk that is what I will have to do.
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Old December 9th, 2008, 03:32 AM   #29
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Ok, so what cushions should I select? I am about 150lbs. Right now I skate on snyder hard cushions in the natural rubber. Would I be best selecting hard in roll-line urethane?
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Old December 9th, 2008, 03:42 AM   #30
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Default Hmm...

First off, I think 170s generally come with clear which is next to hardest.... The yellow hard ones are cement.

Remember, The Roll Line suspension is very different from the Snyder. Angles are the same but the cushion design is totally different..and much bigger...

Ya might want to PM rwsz. He can probably help you more with the comparison than i can. I run all my stuff on the gooey end.

Rick if you are reading this feel free....
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Old December 9th, 2008, 05:46 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TCarlisle View Post
OK, I give up! I started working on replacing the hanger tonight, and for some reason I took apart the wrong skate -- the one that wasn't broke. And what did I find? Another shattered hanger.
Dang, you're hard on stuff! Call Snyder. Yeah, I know, they're really Sure Grip, but there's a couple of old timers out there that might be able to help figure out what's happening.

Quote:
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So I proceeded with attempting to change the hanger on the one skate, and quite frankly it is just going to be too involved. Those rivets are very hard -- harder than my drill bits. Sure I can go get better drill bits, but quite frankly even if I take the time to replace this hanger, then order another and do it again, I still have no confidence in these plates at all.
NOW do you believe me?? Send 'em in!

Mounting another plate isn't difficult. The only time the old holes are a problem is if they're in the way of the new ones, and there are simple remedies for that. I have some old 595s that are on their fifth or sixth mounting, and they're fine. If you can't find someone competent locally, there are any number of people on this forum who can mount plates for you.
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Old December 9th, 2008, 12:06 PM   #32
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Dang, you're hard on stuff! Call Snyder. Yeah, I know, they're really Sure Grip, but there's a couple of old timers out there that might be able to help figure out what's happening.



NOW do you believe me?? Send 'em in!

Mounting another plate isn't difficult. The only time the old holes are a problem is if they're in the way of the new ones, and there are simple remedies for that. I have some old 595s that are on their fifth or sixth mounting, and they're fine. If you can't find someone competent locally, there are any number of people on this forum who can mount plates for you.
It isn't that I didn't believe you, sorry if you got that impression. My issue is that I have to find a way to get this done with no skating downtime. I am lucky enough to live in an area with a lot of skating enthusiasts, and there are a few parties, events, etc. that I don't want to miss.

After the new year, I could tolerate a week or two down, so that leaves me having to live with skating on not one but two broken hangers in the meantime, or go for a plate swap now.

Even if I sucked it up and sent these back to snyder and deal with some downtime, I am still not sure these particular plate designs will provide the durability I require, and I will always skate apprehensively wondering when the next failure will occur. I have never heard of anyone with a roll-line experiencing these types of failures, yet a quick net search will turn up several complaints about these types of issues with a snyder SD.

I simply chose the wrong plate for the application -- I would have probably been fine with a snyder advantage. But in the meantime, I've heard so many great things about roll-line, I am going to give it a try rtaher than upgrade to the synder advantage plate.

So what will happen is I will try to get into a roll-line plate, and then I will take the time to complete the hanger swap on the one and the other I will just send back to snyder. and at least I will then have spare plates so that in the future I don't get stuck in this situation without spares. My last plate was a sure-grip -- not a bad plate, but it was sized wrong for my foot and I know it just wouldn't be possible for me to skate well on it.

As far as the cushions, I will probably order them with medium-hard, and buy a set of medium as well so I can swap, mix/match, etc. to get the response I am looking for.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 04:47 AM   #33
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OK, so the snyders are off and the roll-lines are on. Problem solved more than likely. Time will tell.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 05:04 AM   #34
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Old December 13th, 2008, 11:25 PM   #35
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So I mounted the Mistral pates today, and found it wasn't rocket science. I re-used the existing boots, which were already marked for centerline, and I was happy with the centering of the previous mount, so I just mounted the new plates centered on that same line. I got the rear wheels right under the center o fteh heel, and front wheels right under the ball of my foot -- thanks Doc for helping with the conversion of measurements to get the right baseline.

One of the rear bolts needed to go right where there was one of those nails that hold sthe heel on, so that was a bit of a pain. Other than, pretty simple.

The plates look nice, and the click action adjustment is just too cool. I am going to be able to get very precise control of my skate adjustment with this. I got the clear cushions that came with it, and also got a set of the blue. I am running the clear for the "big" side and the blues on the "smaller" side.

I treated myself to a new set of panther wheels, since mine were beyond worn. Bearings were fine since I maintain my bones swiss every 4 mos with a dissassembly, clean, and lube.

The boot was not yet in need of replcaing, and I wouldn't want to change to a new boot at the same time I change plate make or model, in so as not to change too many variables at once and be stuck if for some reason I don't like the way they skate.

Thanks all for the help. I will be sending the snyder SD plates to snyder so they can fix them, and perhaps give insight as to why there were so many failures. At least then I will have something to use as a spare in the future. But judging from what I see, I don't think the mistrals will fail.

Tonight wil be my first time on them, and I am sure I will have some adjusting to do, but they will end up being fine I am sure.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 11:58 PM   #36
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Have fun and let us know how they skate! I'm dying to go skating tonight, but I don't think it's gonna happen.
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Old December 15th, 2008, 11:39 PM   #37
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OK, so after 20 minutes on the Mistrals, the king pin snapped. Just kidding!

The action is definately quicker. It is really wierd and will take some time to get used to. The timing on everything is just a little different.

But my goodness they are lighter, and very precise.
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Old January 31st, 2009, 07:34 AM   #38
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Red face proper adjustment

Quote:
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If you can break a super tuff kingpin and do it more than once, something is amiss. It's beyond me to tell you what.

Here's what Snyder says about them. (Pardon if redundant)

"Broken King pins can be easily avoided by following these simple procedures:
1) Pivot Pin – pivot pins should be properly adjusted to avoid excessive stress on the king pins. 90% of all broken king pins occur from improperly adjusted pivot pins.
2.) Hex Nuts – Hex nuts should be properly tightened down, not only to avoid a broken king pin, but to avoid a broken hanger lip, which is located under the hex nut. If the hex nut is securely tightened, the hanger lip will not break and you will also save a king pin from breakage.
3.) “Super Tuff” king pins – Snyder “Super Tuff” king pins are fabricated from the same steel that Pratt and Whitney, the makers of jet engines, specifies for the bolts used to attach their engines to aircraft! There are cases though when a skater will break a king pin due to the excessive impact and abuse a king pin takes when a skater comes down from a jump landing. This can be solved by using Snyder’s “Super Tuff” king pins. “Super Tuff” king pins are so tough Snyder will replace and broken or bent “Super Tuff” king pins at no charge and with no questions asked. "
You might post in the Artistic Forum or PM Rick (username "rwsz") and see what he can tell you.
I want to avoid future kingpin breaks too. but what's the pivot and how do you properly adjust it?
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Old January 31st, 2009, 09:54 AM   #39
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OK!

I have read every post in this thread. I have 6 years invested as a Snyder Distributor 69-75. In that timeframe we sold a large volume of Snyder products....Your experience with broken kingpins is outside of any norm for the plates you are using. Especially with yoru body weight! I dont care if you are doing Triple or Quad jumps, the skate is designed ot take that type of work!

Without actually having those skates in fornt of me my instinct tells me you are not adjusting them properly. You should have at the minimum called Snyder and asked them for torque setting ranges to make absolutely sure you were not outside of a reasonable adjustment on each nut both on the pin and the pivot.

For the $$$ minimum that they need to service the change of pins and hangers I would have had them do that work for you as they have all the proper tools to remove and remount those rivets.

Wish you all the best in your endeavors,

Racer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TCarlisle View Post
OK, so after 20 minutes on the Mistrals, the king pin snapped. Just kidding!

The action is definately quicker. It is really wierd and will take some time to get used to. The timing on everything is just a little different.

But my goodness they are lighter, and very precise.
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