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Old October 6th, 2018, 01:21 AM   #1
rufusprime99
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Default Down with Democracy, Long Live the Republic

Today, Democracy lost. That is to be celebrated as Democracy is Mob Rule.

The US is a Republic. Rule of Law. Not Rule of Mob.

For almost 2 years now, Mobs have been trying to overthrow our Government. And they have failed.

Am I here to moan and groan about the Mob? No.

I am feeling optimistic today. I just want to celebrate the victory of Rule of Law.

Happy Friday.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 02:21 AM   #2
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Lex rex.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 03:15 AM   #3
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I'm happy for Kavanaugh, and I feel proceeding with his nomination is the right thing to do.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 04:26 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by rufusprime99 View Post
Today, Democracy lost. That is to be celebrated as Democracy is Mob Rule.

The US is a Republic. Rule of Law. Not Rule of Mob.

For almost 2 years now, Mobs have been trying to overthrow our Government. And they have failed.

Am I here to moan and groan about the Mob? No.

I am feeling optimistic today. I just want to celebrate the victory of Rule of Law.

Happy Friday.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 06:03 AM   #5
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I'm happy for Kavanaugh, and I feel proceeding with his nomination is the right thing to do.
Yeah, absolutely.

One of the FB Groups I am in strives to give voice to both sides, though the guy that started it is conservative. He fell into the trap. He thought that Kavanaugh after all of this is damaged goods. He is smeared. Discredited.

I replied to him, if all the left needs to do is smear a little mud on someone to win a round, the bout is over. Smearing really only works if the mud is real. Not so much the case here.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 02:34 PM   #6
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Right, the Republican party is trampling on the rule of law during the process of vetting a supreme Court Justice, and Drumph is leading the desecration.

Why won't the Republicans allow the FBI to question Brett, and why is Brett afraid of being questioned, and why is the Republican party fast tracking the selection process, are the Republicans afraid of more witnesses stepping forward, don't worry they will, Brett (Bart) will be criminally prosecuted for sexual assault and convicted and the Republican leadership will slink back into their snake dens.

Rule of law is what this country stands on and the Republican party is making a mockery of it.

The light at the end of this slimy, rotten swamp is one month away today, November 6'th is midterms, a blue tsunami is steadily making its way ashore, it's reaching greater speed and height because of Bart, and his Lies to a congressional committee, and soon to the FBI, unless he starts telling the truth, which, is doubtful, the list of lies is well documented, even before this selection process, and the list of new lies is growing, this is sad, thank God the Democrats are able to stomp out the Russian presence and the Republican scum helping the Russians, much less this lying rapeing wannabe, if Drumph were anything but the same this wouldn't be happening.
Drumph is handing this country to the Russians and the Republicn party is in lock step.

Two years ago this administration denied everything Russian, today, it admits everything Russian, everything that has so far been proven, and Mueller is only half way finished.
What we see and hear, all the damage Drumph is doing to the rule of law and the economy is just the tip of the iceberg, then.....there's the damage done to trading partners, not to mention the tariff's being imposed, the economy is about to crumble, what about health care, Drumph will do anything to distract his Drumpettes from the reality of the situation, and yes, the Democratic party will once again fix the "Stupid"
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Old October 6th, 2018, 04:36 PM   #7
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"We must, indeed, all hang together or, most assuredly, we shall all hang separately." Benjamin Franklin

During the signing of the Declaration of Independence Franklin supposedly made this statement. At that time it carried the meaning that the signers (and also the colonists) must act in unity if there was to be any hope of victory in the Revolutionary War and if the war were lost England would track down the signers one by one and hang them.

Why do I bring up this quote in 2018? The state of Maryland has no statute of limitations on felony sexual assault. Even though the Kavanaugh/Ford incedent may not meet felony criteria it seems there is substantial potential that other behaviors of Kavanaugh or his highschool/college wolfpacks may well meet the criteria. The only safe way for his buddies to protect themself as individuals and as a group is for everyone to answer 'I don't recall' and 'I don't remember'. They are not idiots, they know this full well. They do not want to hang their friends or themselves.


OF COURSE there is no FBI-gathered information corroborating the Ford account... how could one expect any other result when so far it seems the only people the the FBI were allowed to contact were wolfpack members and a single Ford friend who Ford has already said was never told at the time. Ford never told ANYONE of it until counseling with her husband.

In light of the current and fully justified "We're mad as hell and we're not going to take it anymore" women's movement I would not be surprised if mature women began filing credible and perhaps provable felony assault complaints against the Kavanaugh crew.

I think Trump reached for a bridge too far when he insisted in keeping Kavanaugh. This may well be the fatal flaw for the Republican party. If convictions (or even just trials) against the Kavanaugh crew happen I could see Kavanaugh being impeached from the Supreme Court. And the embarrassment to the entire USA would fall on Trump's shoulders.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 05:04 PM   #8
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Right, the Republican party is trampling on the rule of law during the process of vetting a supreme Court Justice, and Drumph is leading the desecration.

Why won't the Republicans allow the FBI to question Brett, and why is Brett afraid of being questioned, and why is the Republican party fast tracking the selection process, are the Republicans afraid of more witnesses stepping forward, don't worry they will, Brett (Bart) will be criminally prosecuted for sexual assault and convicted and the Republican leadership will slink back into their snake dens.
On the subject of the Brett Kavanaugh debacle, I heard the FBI felt they already had sufficient testimony from him and Ford, so they were mainly concentrating on witnesses named by Ford, none of which backed her story. If they aren't finding any real evidence to proceed with her claim, why drag this out any longer? I am sure if the party opposed to his nomination really tried, they could find a 100 lunatics to come forward and say Brett showed his weinie, groped them about 40 years ago, supplied them with heroin, was a kingpin to a white slavery ring, etc... but that wouldn't make it true.

I don't consider myself a Republican or a Democrat, so maybe I am looking at this a little more objectively than some, but if Kavanaugh could be kept off the Supreme Court for something like this, how is anyone safe from the effects of slander? Anyone could say almost anything about anyone else and down they go.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 05:20 PM   #9
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The only safe way for his buddies to protect themself as individuals and as a group is for everyone to answer 'I don't recall' and 'I don't remember'. They are not idiots, they know this full well. They do not want to hang their friends or themselves.


OF COURSE there is no FBI-gathered information corroborating the Ford account... how could one expect any other result when so far it seems the only people the the FBI were allowed to contact were wolfpack members and a single Ford friend who Ford has already said was never told at the time. Ford never told ANYONE of it until counseling with her husband.

In light of the current and fully justified "We're mad as hell and we're not going to take it anymore" women's movement I would not be surprised if mature women began filing credible and perhaps provable felony assault complaints against the Kavanaugh crew.
What about her own friend? She didn't back Ford's story either. What she told they shrink was there were 4 guys in the room when she was assaulted. Ford's memory of this whole supposed event is very poor, and we are supposed to trust her version?

The Me Too movement has been an empowering thing for sexual assault victims, but you will always have low life's who will jump on the bandwagon for either personal gain, or to forward their own agenda, so I think it's good to be cautious and not buy into the mob mentality.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 07:37 PM   #10
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On the subject of the Brett Kavanaugh debacle, I heard the FBI felt they already had sufficient testimony from him and Ford, so they were mainly concentrating on witnesses named by Ford, none of which backed her story. If they aren't finding any real evidence to proceed with her claim, why drag this out any longer? I am sure if the party opposed to his nomination really tried, they could find a 100 lunatics to come forward and say Brett showed his weinie, groped them about 40 years ago, supplied them with heroin, was a kingpin to a white slavery ring, etc... but that wouldn't make it true.

I don't consider myself a Republican or a Democrat, so maybe I am looking at this a little more objectively than some, but if Kavanaugh could be kept off the Supreme Court for something like this, how is anyone safe from the effects of slander? Anyone could say almost anything about anyone else and down they go.
No one knows what the FBI did or didn't do, we know who they didn't talk to, and the people they did talk to weren't compelled to say anything, making conclusions about the FBI in the Ford debacle is fraught with mistakes, but we do know that Kavanaugh has outright lied to the congressional committee that gave him his present appointment, and we know he outright lied to the Senate committee questioning him for SCOTUS concerning drinking allegations, drinking age allegations and personal conduct allegations, not to mention all the allegations brought forward by various women, fibs are lies, Kavanugh doesn't have the trust of Most of the public.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 07:50 PM   #11
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What about her own friend? She didn't back Ford's story either. What she told they shrink was there were 4 guys in the room when she was assaulted. Ford's memory of this whole supposed event is very poor, and we are supposed to trust her version?

The Me Too movement has been an empowering thing for sexual assault victims, but you will always have low life's who will jump on the bandwagon for either personal gain, or to forward their own agenda, so I think it's good to be cautious and not buy into the mob mentality.
Let's not start untrue statements, she stated there were four others at the party-gathering, and there were two others in the bedroom where she was forcibly sexually assaulted, let's stick to the facts of her statement and not put words in her mouth she didn't say.
Until a thorough investigation is undertaken, investigating everyone involved, she deserves respect, she took a lie detector test, She wants to talk to the FBI, she wants to get to the bottom of this, she feels Kavanaugh is not a person that deserves to be SCOTUS, and most of the public agrees that she should have that investigation, without restraint by the White House, which has every reason not to allow it, well, Kavanaugh as SCOTUS would give Trump a free get out of jail card.
Kavanaugh on the other hand won't answer the question, will he talk to the FBI, no answer, will he take a lie detector test, no answer, what's he hiding?

BTW, did you see that Susan Rice is considering running against Collins in Maine, this abuse of power is coming to an end, to put this matter in perspective.


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Old October 6th, 2018, 08:07 PM   #12
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... so I think it's good to be cautious and not buy into the mob mentality.
YES! absolutely true and I whole heartedly agree. I am very saddened by what has transpired.

IF (IF!) Kavanaugh is truely innocent of all this behavior this would be a huge travesty.... a bell that cannot be un-rung. The crap is irretrievably out there. But I do not hold out much hope regarding his youth and college character. There have been way too many tell-tail warning signs in the way he currently presents that point to the allegations being credible.

Now, having said the above regarding Kavanaugh and my perception of his early years, I must say that I do believe people can mature beyond youthful indescretions and misdeeds... leave behind the party-boy Mr. Hyde and move forward with the socially responsible Dr. Jekyll side of their personality. It really seems Kavanaugh has, and I respect that.

What I do not respect is that Kavanaugh seems to be unable to own up to having Mr Hyde side in his youth. If he did I'd cut him some slack.

From the way you discuss the Ford counseling notes, Ford's recollections and her friend's report it seems you do not have any direct familiarity with these sorts of things. I do in an amature sense. Suicide and suicide prevention. Drug addiction and rehabilitation. Reviewing/correlating counseling notes.

Actually, Ford's memories AND GAPS are very typical for this kind of situation. Victims often have 'tunnel vision' memories. Her friend having no recollection is also not at all unusual. Nothing happened to her that day, she went on partying. Just another normal day for her. Nothing noteworthy to remember since Ford never told her anything. Friend didn't know Kavanaugh? Friend was most likely highly focused on a boy that wasn't drunk on his ass and didn't get introduced to Kavanaugh.

Regarding you saying she told her therapist there were 4 in the room during the assault... I'd really like to know where this came from. As best I know nobody has had access to those records. I recall testimony that there were 'at least 4 boys' at the house. Besides, it is not uncommon for a therapist to get the session notes slightly wrong when writing them up from memory after the session has ended. Therapist is not building a legal case... is trying to capture the primary gist of the session progress.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 09:23 PM   #13
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I heard the FBI felt they already had sufficient testimony from him and Ford, so they were mainly concentrating on witnesses named by Ford, none of which backed her story. If they aren't finding any real evidence to proceed with her claim, why drag this out any longer?
It seems clear to me that what you heard (or what you thought you heard) is flawed. The FBI was ready and wanted to put an army of people on this but were stopped. The President, the 'customer' in total control of this effort severly boxed in the FBI, apparently for the purpose of preventing the the discovery of an observable pattern of behavior. The FBI does not have the authority or inclination to tell the President "we don't need to talk to this individual" for any reason.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 10:21 PM   #14
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Let's not start untrue statements, she stated there were four others at the party-gathering, and there were two others in the bedroom where she was forcibly sexually assaulted, let's stick to the facts of her statement and not put words in her mouth she didn't say.
http://www.independentsentinel.com/c...-up-her-story/
https://www.americanthinker.com/arti...#ixzz5TBebXTc9

In addition, her therapist's notes say there were four boys present "from an elitist boys' school," whereas in the Feinstein letter, she claims only two assailants (Kavanaugh and Judge). Both have categorically denied the allegations, with Judge calling the accusation "absolutely nuts."

Blasey Ford says the therapist made a mistake in his notes. Her claim is that a therapist, who by definition and job description must rely heavily on his notes to delineate and document needed therapy, made a mistake. Yet, though he was incompetent enough to make an error of fact, he was still sufficiently competent to save his notes for six years.


So her therapist is wrong? As much as I feel for any genuine victim of sexual assault, there are more holes in her story than a slice of Swiss cheese. I don't believe him 100 percent, I think he is underestimating his drinking habits in college, but I find him more credible.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 10:36 PM   #15
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YES! absolutely true and I whole heartedly agree. I am very saddened by what has transpired.

IF (IF!) Kavanaugh is truely innocent of all this behavior this would be a huge travesty.... a bell that cannot be un-rung. The crap is irretrievably out there. But I do not hold out much hope regarding his youth and college character. There have been way too many tell-tail warning signs in the way he currently presents that point to the allegations being credible.

Now, having said the above regarding Kavanaugh and my perception of his early years, I must say that I do believe people can mature beyond youthful indescretions and misdeeds... leave behind the party-boy Mr. Hyde and move forward with the socially responsible Dr. Jekyll side of their personality. It really seems Kavanaugh has, and I respect that.

What I do not respect is that Kavanaugh seems to be unable to own up to having Mr Hyde side in his youth. If he did I'd cut him some slack.

From the way you discuss the Ford counseling notes, Ford's recollections and her friend's report it seems you do not have any direct familiarity with these sorts of things. I do in an amature sense. Suicide and suicide prevention. Drug addiction and rehabilitation. Reviewing/correlating counseling notes.

Actually, Ford's memories AND GAPS are very typical for this kind of situation. Victims often have 'tunnel vision' memories. Her friend having no recollection is also not at all unusual. Nothing happened to her that day, she went on partying. Just another normal day for her. Nothing noteworthy to remember since Ford never told her anything. Friend didn't know Kavanaugh? Friend was most likely highly focused on a boy that wasn't drunk on his ass and didn't get introduced to Kavanaugh.

Regarding you saying she told her therapist there were 4 in the room during the assault... I'd really like to know where this came from. As best I know nobody has had access to those records. I recall testimony that there were 'at least 4 boys' at the house. Besides, it is not uncommon for a therapist to get the session notes slightly wrong when writing them up from memory after the session has ended. Therapist is not building a legal case... is trying to capture the primary gist of the session progress.
I would like to know what you are reading as well, and it would be a mistake to assume I haven't had any medical training or classes in psychology. I studied nursing before switching to computer science. Again, I trust that the therapist's account of what she said more than I do hers 6 years later. Also, she seemed pretty reluctant to turn her therapy notes over, especially if she wants to use these as evidence that this event occurred. I think Kavanaugh felt too attacked to be entirely honest about the drinking, even though, I think it's a mistake to focus too much on that. College kids party.

If you are familiar with the concepts of therapy, you are also familiar with false memories. Which is what I hope is going on here. I can't say for certainty Brett didn't grope her, none of us can, I believe it is more likely than not based on everything I have heard and read that he didn't.

I am upset with the fact that this man has kind of become the whipping boy for everyone pissed at Trump or some other man who assaulted them. Innocent until proven guilty, and they have proven nothing.
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Old October 6th, 2018, 11:29 PM   #16
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http://www.independentsentinel.com/c...-up-her-story/
https://www.americanthinker.com/arti...#ixzz5TBebXTc9

In addition, her therapist's notes say there were four boys present "from an elitist boys' school," whereas in the Feinstein letter, she claims only two assailants (Kavanaugh and Judge). Both have categorically denied the allegations, with Judge calling the accusation "absolutely nuts."

Blasey Ford says the therapist made a mistake in his notes. Her claim is that a therapist, who by definition and job description must rely heavily on his notes to delineate and document needed therapy, made a mistake. Yet, though he was incompetent enough to make an error of fact, he was still sufficiently competent to save his notes for six years.


So her therapist is wrong? As much as I feel for any genuine victim of sexual assault, there are more holes in her story than a slice of Swiss cheese. I don't believe him 100 percent, I think he is underestimating his drinking habits in college, but I find him more credible.
The first link tries to add and change, until the therapist's notes are released, the facts stand, four others at the party two boys in the bedroom where she was forcably sexually abused.
The second link tags onto the first but actually adds the words "smoke pot", that's a new twist, unheard of before, leave it to a non factual source to try and confuse the situation.
The FBI never interviewed all of Kavanaugh's classmates that have been coming forward to refute his description of his Sunday School ways, 1600+ Federal judges have declared Kavanaugh unfit, he's toast, his opinions will be reversed, his ability to practice law will be stripped, all the while he's the laughing stock of every Law school and Court in the nation.

Now that the Supreme court has a new member with a cloud of dishonesty and sexual deviancy hanging over him, much less stated partisanship, what's next, cancel the elections and declare Drumph king, Na, facts matter, Trump is scrambling, the facts are adding up.
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Old October 7th, 2018, 12:13 AM   #17
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The first link tries to add and change, until the therapist's notes are released, the facts stand, four others at the party two boys in the bedroom where she was forcably sexually abused.
The second link tags onto the first but actually adds the words "smoke pot", that's a new twist, unheard of before, leave it to a non factual source to try and confuse the situation.
The FBI never interviewed all of Kavanaugh's classmates that have been coming forward to refute his description of his Sunday School ways, 1600+ Federal judges have declared Kavanaugh unfit, he's toast, his opinions will be reversed, his ability to practice law will be stripped, all the while he's the laughing stock of every Law school and Court in the nation.

Now that the Supreme court has a new member with a cloud of dishonesty and sexual deviancy hanging over him, much less stated partisanship, what's next, cancel the elections and declare Drumph king, Na, facts matter, Trump is scrambling, the facts are adding up.
If the therapist's word doesn't convince you, I am not sure how their notes will. Kavanaugh doesn't deny enjoying beer, and many of us have been guilty of that. Fortunately, college-aged partying is not a crime. I can't help but think you are letting your political feelings cloud your judgement about what constitutes fair treatment for Brett Kavanaugh. I am glad some of us are more capable of separating the two.
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Old October 7th, 2018, 01:03 AM   #18
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If the therapist's word doesn't convince you, I am not sure how their notes will. Kavanaugh doesn't deny enjoying beer, and many of us have been guilty of that. Fortunately, college-aged partying is not a crime. I can't help but think you are letting your political feelings cloud your judgement about what constitutes fair treatment for Brett Kavanaugh. I am glad some of us are more capable of separating the two.

Again, the therapist's notes are notes, let's see the notes, let's see the file, let's not assume.
Kavanaugh needs to agree to be interviewed and his associates need to be interviewed, they, he, are, is, are, hiding the truth, she isn't, if a thorough investigation reveals her to be a nut job and he to be an honest, never having lied, never having raped, never having started a bar fight (police record), good, the public opinion will reflect just that, at the moment, it doesn't.

Yes, admitting beer 50 times, while underage, and lying about that fact is a problem.

My judgement is concerned by the fact that this, now, SCOTUS person is dishonest, sexual indescretions aside, meltdown while applying for the job, not aside, emotionally despondent, moraly corrupt, and a liar during congressional hearings, now he's got his finger on the rights of women to control their bodies, soon he will have his finger on the legal battles of this incompetent president and his "controllers" and every little facet of what used to be common decency for the next thirty years.
Political is no longer in this context, political left the building with the arming of the Republican army to March against common sense, destroying the environment, ballooning the deficit, and God only knows what military actions are happening, and what actual economic sanctions are taking place, we are in the dark when it comes to government policy, so much for oversight.
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Old October 7th, 2018, 01:11 AM   #19
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If the therapist's word doesn't convince you, I am not sure how their notes will. Kavanaugh doesn't deny enjoying beer, and many of us have been guilty of that. Fortunately, college-aged partying is not a crime. I can't help but think you are letting your political feelings cloud your judgement about what constitutes fair treatment for Brett Kavanaugh. I am glad some of us are more capable of separating the two.
i think everyone seems to have a little clouded judgement.
ursle you seem very one eyed and ignorant of the fact that the US economy is rocketing .Theres always a side effect of course {most likely the farming export sector}.
People in australia cannot deny trump has been a great thing for the US economy .
The big picture is nobodys perfect and kavanagh is as much controlled as trump,bush,the clintons,etc and everyone that is willing to be a front man/person for any part in law and politics .
Dont be fooled by thinking one is superior to the other because there are limits.
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Old October 7th, 2018, 01:30 AM   #20
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Again, the therapist's notes are notes, let's see the notes, let's see the file, let's not assume.
Kavanaugh needs to agree to be interviewed and his associates need to be interviewed, they, he, are, is, are, hiding the truth, she isn't, if a thorough investigation reveals her to be a nut job and he to be an honest, never having lied, never having raped, never having started a bar fight (police record), good, the public opinion will reflect just that, at the moment, it doesn't.

Yes, admitting beer 50 times, while underage, and lying about that fact is a problem.

My judgement is concerned by the fact that this, now, SCOTUS person is dishonest, sexual indescretions aside, meltdown while applying for the job, not aside, emotionally despondent, moraly corrupt, and a liar during congressional hearings, now he's got his finger on the rights of women to control their bodies, soon he will have his finger on the legal battles of this incompetent president and his "controllers" and every little facet of what used to be common decency for the next thirty years.
Political is no longer in this context, political left the building with the arming of the Republican army to March against common sense, destroying the environment, ballooning the deficit, and God only knows what military actions are happening, and what actual economic sanctions are taking place, we are in the dark when it comes to government policy, so much for oversight.
I would still say his track record for honesty is better than hers. There are always going to be government paperwork that is not going to be released to the public, and often there is good reasoning behind this logic.

Kavanaugh was interviewed, and publicly televised from what I understand (I was at work), as well as Ford. How much slime should this man have to wade through? I suspect nothing will satisfy those who are mad to have another conservative on the court. Be reasonable.

Brett might be conservative, but he is 53 years old, with 2 young school age daughters. Now I could be wrong, but I don't believe he is going to act in a way that doesn't reflect their best interests, including their right to choose to end a pregnancy.

Feel free to be unhappy, but know you are doing it to yourselves. Very likely for nothing if you are concerned about female rights.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/rea...gh-allegations
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