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Old March 15th, 2017, 05:29 PM   #1
Doc Sk8
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Default Standard setting for getting the maximum performance from the cushion.

I pulled this out of another discussion, because I think there is such a thing. Granted, this is from a mechanical standpoint not a personal performance stand point.

The max urethane cushion performance comes from the cushion being under no preload until you step on it.

Why?? As I have pointed out before, urethane is not compressible so as a cushion is tightened it changes shape. It can only change shape to it's max extent, so every bit of adjustment tighter removes some of the cushions ability to perform.

Its why my Pro Lines have taller barrels them stock. Taller cushions provide more room to change shape.

Replacing cup retainers w/ flat washers can also help get that max performance. Laser figured that out decades ago. Too bad everyone still thinks the cup is necessary...

So how does one tune the action when the best adjustment is zero lash?? Play with the cushions. We have a huge smorgasbord of availible cushions to plaw with for most sk8s. Play with 'em and quit cranking down and choking your action.

Just thought I would toss that out.
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Old March 15th, 2017, 06:04 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Doc Sk8 View Post
I pulled this out of another discussion, because I think there is such a thing. Granted, this is from a mechanical standpoint not a personal performance stand point.

The max urethane cushion performance comes from the cushion being under no preload until you step on it.

Why?? As I have pointed out before, urethane is not compressible so as a cushion is tightened it changes shape. It can only change shape to it's max extent, so every bit of adjustment tighter removes some of the cushions ability to perform.

Its why my Pro Lines have taller barrels them stock. Taller cushions provide more room to change shape.

Replacing cup retainers w/ flat washers can also help get that max performance. Laser figured that out decades ago. Too bad everyone still thinks the cup is necessary...

So how does one tune the action when the best adjustment is zero lash?? Play with the cushions. We have a huge smorgasbord of availible cushions to plaw with for most sk8s. Play with 'em and quit cranking down and choking your action.

Just thought I would toss that out.

I agree!!! I run very light preload, just enough that the truck doesn't rock loose. And tall cushions.
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Old March 15th, 2017, 08:57 PM   #3
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Thanks Doc. Your simple explanation removes any confusion on the matter. I've always wondered how to adjust the cushions according to the numbers on my Roll-lines. It sounds like I need to back of the tension until there is no compression, at which point I line up the mark on the cushion cup at the #1 setting on the adjustment nut, and tighten as needed.

It's clear, you aren't practicing skateology without a license.
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Old March 15th, 2017, 11:59 PM   #4
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Thanks Doc. Your simple explanation removes any confusion on the matter. I've always wondered how to adjust the cushions according to the numbers on my Roll-lines. It sounds like I need to back of the tension until there is no compression, at which point I line up the mark on the cushion cup at the #1 setting on the adjustment nut, and tighten as needed.

It's clear, you aren't practicing skateology without a license.
Interesting... Apparently, I have never looked @ the Roll Line action close enough. (My original Mistrals were pre click and quite frankly, I thought the click was a step backwards.) I have never noticed an index mark on the click action. Sure, I have seen the numbers but not anything to index them against.... I just used straight ahead as the reference and then noted what number was there. Now I will have to go out and look @ a new Roll Line and see what I missed.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 12:33 AM   #5
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Does this assume an adjustable pivot?

If the pivot is not adjustable, you don't give it any consideration when adjusting tension?

What is zero lash?
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Old March 16th, 2017, 01:33 AM   #6
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No lash means no movement.No slop.

No adjustable pivot means they should ve got there engineering correct so pivot sits in cup properly.
Use the correct size cushion and all should be good.
Adjusting comes down to what you like.
But basically if you like it loose use a soft cushion .
No movement use a hard cushion.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 06:52 PM   #7
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Does this assume an adjustable pivot?

This "assumes" any properly engineered pivot.

If the pivot is not adjustable, you don't give it any consideration when adjusting tension?

I only get concerned when the semi precision pivots (Boens, Pro Lines, Lasers Novas, Ultimates... There are a few.) wind up being loose. That can be bad for the cup or worse, bad for the sk8rs. Rubber bushed pivots?? I ignore them except to be replaced when worn. and wear they do. They are consumable like wheels. I have never seen a rubber bushed pivot pin be even close to coming out of the cup when the action is set to zero lash.

What is zero lash?
Automotive term. Comes from adjusting valve train lifters. Mechanical tappet cams typically need a bit of clearance (lash) in the valve train. This is set when the engine is @ operating temperature. Alternatively hydraulic cam valve trains are typically set to zero clearance when the engine is hot. (Note: I am not going into the nutz, boltz and screwballs of how to do this.. Lots of videos on the web)

I use that term to describe no obvious "rattle" in the sk8 action, but still being able to turn one of the cushion retainers. Essentially adjusted as loose as possible, without any of the components being loose.

@
sk84luv I have noted no reference marks on any of the 4 click Roll Lines in the shop...
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Old March 16th, 2017, 09:55 PM   #8
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Automotive term. Comes from adjusting valve train lifters. Mechanical tappet cams typically need a bit of clearance (lash) in the valve train. This is set when the engine is @ operating temperature. Alternatively hydraulic cam valve trains are typically set to zero clearance when the engine is hot. (Note: I am not going into the nutz, boltz and screwballs of how to do this.. Lots of videos on the web)

I use that term to describe no obvious "rattle" in the sk8 action, but still being able to turn one of the cushion retainers. Essentially adjusted as loose as possible, without any of the components being loose.

@
sk84luv I have noted no reference marks on any of the 4 click Roll Lines in the shop...
Here is a cup from the mistral. Perhaps yours are an older style with no mark.
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Old March 17th, 2017, 05:41 PM   #9
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Default Uh,

The Mistral pic is not showing up here??

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Old March 18th, 2017, 02:40 PM   #10
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Awesome info Doc - thanks! Anyone else feel something missing since Richard/Dillo passed? He surely would have been able to add to this post. RIP Richard.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 05:10 PM   #11
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The Mistral pic is not showing up here??

Weird. I see it in my post as uploaded from my google images account.

Let's try this upload from my photobucket.[IMG][/IMG]
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Old March 20th, 2017, 08:09 PM   #12
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Default Can see it now.

I don't have any of those marks on any of my click retainers. Must be too old.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 08:35 PM   #13
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[QUOTE=Doc Sk8;724781]I don't have any of those marks on any of my click retainers. Must be too old. [/QUOTE
Doc, I bought mine seven years ago. Here's how I recently adjusted mine after reading your original post: 1. Hand tighten adjusting nut to point of resistance. 2. Turn click action to desired setting. 3. Experiment, experiment, experiment.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 11:51 PM   #14
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Default Atlas Cushion Retainer

Quote:
Originally Posted by sk84luv View Post
Weird. I see it in my post as uploaded from my google images account.

Let's try this upload from my photobucket.[IMG][/IMG]
Looks the same design as the Atlas Cushion retainer, can't recall stamped numbers but the click action is adjusted from the top (nearest the boot)
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Old March 21st, 2017, 08:34 PM   #15
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Red face This is embarrassing....

After seeing the pic and then giving my Roll Lines a close look I noted the marks. You would have though I would have seen them before now..

Still not much utility. The whole purpose of the click action is to be able to do this without looking. Just count the clicks. On the Roll Lines, I just back them off until the nut hits the stop bolt and then turn them in counting clicks. My personal setting 1 click. 2 on my Rings.

Gotta love it when ya learn something new...especially what what you thought you knew was wrong.
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 10:55 PM   #16
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I don't have any of those marks on any of my click retainers. Must be too old.
The plates, you mean?
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Old March 24th, 2017, 03:53 PM   #17
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The plates, you mean?
Yeah, that is what I thought I meant.
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